Brian Michael Bendis

Sponsor Sketch: Deadly Grounds Coffee.

Leo Pond [00:03:43]: Hey, hey, happy Tuesday everybody and welcome to Splash Pages. We have an amazing schedule for you. Holy crap, what the heck was that? Anyway, okay, we'll quickly go through the run. Kari, how's it going?

Kari Sanders [00:03:59]: Going great. Happy St. Paddy's Day everybody. Happy Tuesday. Glad to see you all here. We have an amazing show like Leo was saying and we got a lot of people here tonight. So let's just skip on around and see how our other goth is doing.

Jar Jar Jeremy [00:04:12]: I'm not the other Goth, but hey, how's it going? Uh, happy to see you all. Hi Sophia in the comments. Uh, oh yeah, everybody knows her. Um, so yeah, let's get to the show, Drew. Or hold on, no, no, we'll get to MJ.

Leo Pond [00:04:33]: Popped in. Hey MJ.

Mahanna Jade [00:04:35]: Yeah, sorry about that, guys. Really bad windstorms and an internet was out for a bit, but I'm back and we've got power even, so I'm really, I'm really looking forward to tonight's show.

Leo Pond [00:04:46]: Awesome, awesome. Mr. Drew, who do we got with us today?

Drew Mollo [00:04:49]: Well, one of the first things first, everybody, first things first, officially happy St. Patrick's Day to you all. Here's a Guinness. Love y'all.

Jar Jar Jeremy [00:04:58]: Morning.

Drew Mollo [00:04:59]: All right, so everybody, we geek out a lot at this show. We have a lot of great guests, legends in the industry, big people. Inkers, you know, salt of the land. The guest we have on tonight is one of my personal all-time favorite writers of the last decades, plural. There's very few things in Marvel he hasn't touched in terms of characters. Everything is fantastic— Spider-Man, Avengers, Ultimate X-Men, Ultimate Spider-Man, Ultimate Fantastic Four. Everything. Alias, Daredevil, Man of Steel, Batman, the list goes on and on.

Drew Mollo [00:05:41]: Um, again, I'm— I had to change my shirt because I was so excited. It was originally a white shirt, the black one. But everybody, the one, the only, the extremely chatty but still smiling Brian Michael Bendis.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:05:57]: Hey, that was very nice. Thank you, thank you guys. Oh, thank you.

Jar Jar Jeremy [00:06:07]: It's crazy indeed.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:06:11]: All right, um, I'm an open book. Whatever you guys want to talk about, whatever's on your mind, well, let's, let's chat.

Drew Mollo [00:06:17]: Well, Brian, I need to start with us. I need to start with the first time I met you because you had this great moment that I still tell everyone my story. So it was 2016, a special edition. I found out while waiting online from somebody, because I make line friends really easily, that you were doing a signing. Because I think like Powers Season 2 from PlayStation was happening around then, so that's why you were there. And I was like, oh my God, I brought some just in case Bendis was here. So I'm waiting online, I meet you, it's amazing. I wish I had more books.

Drew Mollo [00:06:51]: You're like, I'll sign whatever you have. And I'm just like, I could have brought more. I only have this many. And you signed everything. But, but the thing that got me was I was wearing this, um, everybody, you know, my, my Gorillaz Ghostbusters Demon Days shirt. It was Gozer Days. And you're like, oh, that's such a cool design. Can I take a photo? And I was like, what? And you took a photo of it.

Drew Mollo [00:07:11]: And there was an anniversary present from my— for my girlfriend. I'm still a girlfriend of 10 years. Um, and, and I was like— I texted her like right after it happened. I was like, babe, I love you. And she's like, just like, okay, why?

Brian Michael Bendis [00:07:23]: What?

Drew Mollo [00:07:23]: Like, why today especially? And, and she was like, because of you. There's a photo of the shirt that you got me, a symbol of our love and my geekdom for Gorillaz. Is in Brian Michael Bendis's Flip Phone.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:07:36]: Flip Phone. Flip Phone.

Drew Mollo [00:07:38]: I believe it was a Flip Phone. I'm not sure. It was definitely not a Motorola, as we know those are in, in, um, um, indestructible. Yes, yes, you know. But that happened, and I've been telling that story forever, and I was like, guys, it was like the greatest moment ever. That, and around that time Ultimate End was happening, and I brought you the Scotty Young, uh, cover, which was you dropping the mic, is the Ultimate Universe, right? And you customized it because you wrote it as Ultimate Bendis, I believe. And I have a photo with you when we posted it on, um— yeah, see, there you go. See, the man gets it.

Drew Mollo [00:08:14]: Um, I just need to say that meant the world to me, um, just as a fan, that I had that moment. And I, and I've sang praises about it, and everybody's like, that's so fucking rad. So I just want to tell you, like, 10 years later, here you are again, and I'm so much better dressed and the shirt still fits.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:08:32]: So everybody, good on all, all fronts. A, Gorillaz were just on SNL last week and they killed. Yeah, they were weird. They killed at a level few do on SNL. So I'm a big fan of theirs. It was nice to see, like, you know, there's, there's a big comic book contingent to Gorillaz because of Jamie Hewlett's, uh, participation in it. So every time Gorillaz enters a new space. Like, seeing all of his work on SNL so prominently, I was like, is this the first comic book creator whose work has been this prominently shown on SNL? I think it's amazing.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:09:05]: So yeah, and I was probably looking for that shirt to no avail because I—

Drew Mollo [00:09:11]: oh my God, yeah.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:09:12]: But Gorillaz merch in the house.

Drew Mollo [00:09:13]: Should we tell him the John Siuntres story?

Kari Sanders [00:09:17]: Oh, just a second. First, I wanted to let people know, um, we'll be getting to all of your questions in chat. We're going to kind of go through when we get on the subjects of stuff, we'll bring them up, or we'll have moments to go. We also have a couple questions from people on Reddit, so, um, I— we will get to you. We aren't ignoring you. Keep them going. Yay.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:09:35]: Uh, yeah, we'll get through.

Kari Sanders [00:09:36]: Go ahead.

Drew Mollo [00:09:37]: Yeah, yeah. So, um, we're also really good friends with the great John Siuntres, as he is a frequent guest, uh, at Terrificon, which is kind of one of our home-based cons.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:09:47]: I will be there eventually. I will be there eventually.

Drew Mollo [00:09:49]: Yeah, well, I get it. When you are—

Brian Michael Bendis [00:09:51]: good weekend—

Drew Mollo [00:09:52]: this guy will be at least 7th in line. Fair enough. Not number 1, definitely within the top 20.

Jar Jar Jeremy [00:09:58]: Since I'm his camera guy, I'll probably be 8th in line, and I'll have—

Drew Mollo [00:10:02]: yeah, exactly—

Jar Jar Jeremy [00:10:03]: hours.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:10:04]: Yes.

Drew Mollo [00:10:05]: Um, but we're friends with John Siuntres, and it's John— you know, John was, uh, one of the principals in Ultimate Spider-Man and, and kept making the occasional cameo And because me and Kari— because I'm a huge Ultimate Spider-Man fan, Ultimate Universe in general— and I got Kari hooked on it. And she was reading and said, oh my God, that's John from Word Balloon! And I was like, oh my God. And so we, we brought the, the first time he shows up, like, we brought all the issues of Ultimate Spider-Man for John to sign.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:10:37]: That's awesome.

Drew Mollo [00:10:38]: And he was just like, oh my God, no one has ever asked me to do this. And he, of course, you know, in true style, had, um, you know, a Sharpie to sign because, you know, you got to have your gold and the silver. You got to have, you know, um, he was so happy. He was like, no one has ever done this. We like this, this means the world to me and everything. Like, he, he said it was so funny anytime you got to put him in. And I think it was either when he was the principal and getting interrogating Aunt May or yelling at the, the parents during, during that whole Kitty Pryde fiasco, or especially our favorite one is when he sees Miles outside of his window and he just faints.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:11:18]: That's my—

Drew Mollo [00:11:18]: collapses in the middle of eating a sandwich.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:11:21]: Yeah, yeah, I love John. John's, John's been pioneering this space that we're all sitting in right now for many, many years. I was, I was there early days with him before like podcast was a word, you know. So it's, uh, it's, you know, it's also generationally. Stan used to put people in the media and friends into his comics. Roy Thomas did it. It was always like these little Easter eggs for people who knew, you know. So it just seemed— it seemed perfect.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:11:51]: And his voice is in my head, so that's the voice I'm gonna write. Yeah, perfect.

Kari Sanders [00:11:55]: You, you are a king of Easter eggs, sir, I must say.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:11:59]: I love him as a fan. I love experiencing Easter eggs, so Yeah, I, yeah, I want to bring up—

Kari Sanders [00:12:05]: this is— and we're gonna— I'm just kind of jumping in here. This is one thing we aren't necessarily going to this comic, but my favorite Easter egg out of all of the reading we did for this was in Sam and Twitch. And you're everywhere in that, all the books and stuff. And but seeing Ugly Sluts magazine with the Bendis interview on the front, and then the girl with the paper bag over her head. It's— there's like this huge fight scene going on and it's one of the magazines that's falling off and there's just like this— at least let's find this.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:12:39]: I will say, girl, sometimes the artist is doing— that's an artist Easter egg. Like, I've been both the author of and the victim of Easter eggs, so I— I— that one, I— geez, I don't remember writing those words, so I'm gonna say it was— I was the artist on that one. But that's funny. It's always done with love. It's always a loving thing. It's really fun.

Kari Sanders [00:13:01]: Yeah, I just, I just never—

Drew Mollo [00:13:04]: I—

Brian Michael Bendis [00:13:05]: yeah, I have no idea what we're even referencing with Ugly Sluts magazine. I don't even know what that is. Yeah, okay, that's funny. Anyway, yeah, the '90s.

Drew Mollo [00:13:16]: Well, the thing that I especially loved about Sam and Twitch— I mean, if we're talking about that Um, was that how little Spawn is in it? And yeah, which, which the thing that I loved was— and Jar is also a subtle Spawn fan alongside me, so just reading this was such a trip, seeing Al just pop up. And you have the great Angel Medina doing it, who is one of the many Spawn collaborators for like 20 or so issues, which in the span of Spawn is a decent amount of time. Like, a lot happens in 20 to 30 issues.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:13:54]: Uh, 18, I can't remember.

Drew Mollo [00:13:55]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But, but so basically doing the whole thing, and, and like Spawn shows up and he's like, I need your help. And Sam is like, we're in the middle of something. And he's like, but it was like, fuck off, get lost. Yeah. And, and, and I'm just thinking to myself like, this is This is Al Simmons, the Slayer of Malbolgia, the Fighter of Mamon. Like, he has killed angels, demons. He has cut off Violator's head so many times.

Drew Mollo [00:14:26]: And yet this human overweight detective with, you know, who looks like he could be related to DC's Harvey Bullock, is just like, fuck off. All right, cool.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:14:35]: Yeah, it was a— it was a great opportunity. It was a great gig for a couple of reasons. Is number one, I didn't know at the time, but I was, um, uh, I was new to collaboration. I had done my own comics for a long time, like most of the '90s was me writing and drawing, lettering, designing every single aspect of book design, my own comics, Jinx, Torso, all those books. So when I got— was starting to get the call to do like collaborating with people, like you're going to write for someone like Angel Medina, who I could not draw like Angel Medina, if you paid me, and people have, and I couldn't. So it was a real— I, I needed to learn some things about collaboration, and those 18 issues, I think it was, was like super preparing me for what was about to come, which was Ultimate Spider-Man Daredevil. Like, like there was a, a, like a hurricane of what became addictive collaboration, and just finding my, myself in the collaboration was, uh was a great deal of— I, I learned so much on those, and I was very grateful. Todd was a great boss in that he let us just go do it, and if I don't like it, I'll fire you, you know.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:15:46]: And, and so I just got to like figure myself out on those pages, including hiring Alex Maleev for the last few, which was just someone whose work I was aspiring towards. And then we got to work together, and even those 5 issues on Sam and Twitch, whatever, whatever, like, you know, just figuring each other's energy out. By the time we got to Daredevil, we had figured it out, like, so we got to hit the ground running on Daredevil in a way that was a gift, you know. Like, sometimes it just takes a few issues to, you know, figure each other out and stuff, but like, uh, Sam and Twitch made things easier. And also, like, how do I communicate myself to an artist who's better than me, you know what I mean? How do I communicate subtext to, you know, how do I write towards them versus towards me? And all that was very beneficial. So happy. And I did get to write a little Spawn. I do— I did a few issues of Hellspawn.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:16:41]: It wasn't for me, um, it wasn't my vibe, but I— but even like doing that was like helpful to figure out where is my vibe, like where am I in all this. So I was very grateful for that as well.

Drew Mollo [00:16:54]: So, and go, Karen.

Kari Sanders [00:16:58]: Okay, I had a question. This has to do with the collaboration that you did. Um, the decision not to use word balloons was— it was excellent, it was bold.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:17:08]: And yeah, we talked about this.

Kari Sanders [00:17:10]: Yeah, yeah, I— oh, I— yeah, we, we talked about this before, how when we were reading, uh, Richard Stark's, uh, Hunter, that it was like really hard sometimes to read what he was writing. And I read all the letters and I absolutely disagree with Olaf Beamer saying that it was hard to read. I think that you guys did a great job keeping it highlighted when it needed to be and putting it over black or black over white as you did it. I love that Todd set this up for you and the way that it worked because you're very verbose and it gave you a way to keep the flow and the pacing. So as you were collaborating, was it difficult at the start to get everybody used to getting the spaces right and to do it, or did you guys just hop right into it.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:17:52]: I know, I, I, I, I have very strong memories of doing many, many, many drafts of everything and figuring it out on the page. And also, yeah, those balloons being gone was— it was, it was an interesting exercise because it does change your relationship to the words and their placement in it. You know, I, I tell my students— I teach comics writing with David Walker here in Portland— and where I was like, you remember, every, every balloon is a Post-it note right on top of the art. Like, you're literally like covering up art. It's the only, like, medium that does that. So you have to really consider, like, what are you doing with that Post-it note that you're sticking on maybe one of the most beautiful drawings in the world? So having that gone, but then the— again, the font is different, everything is different. It was really a great exercise. Again, I wouldn't have tried it.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:18:43]: Like, that was, that was what was given. It has aged well, like, because now there's a lot of people just doing different stuff. They're not like, you know, Comic Sans all the way. It's every— everyone's trying different fonts and different techniques as they go. So it has aged well. I appreciate that. And I must say, I remember at the time getting a letter from Olaf Beemer— this is like pre-internet when there was like a couple of letter hacks that were as famous to me as the creators themselves. Like, like, oh, you see Olaf Beemer's name in Sandman, right? So you're like, oh my God, it's that guy! Like, I was really just I felt like, oh, I mean, really, I'm in comics.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:19:22]: Like, this is comic. So yes, there's this—

Mahanna Jade [00:19:27]: there was a certain form of fanboying, fangirling knowing that we're coming up here. Come on, the shows! Oh my God.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:19:34]: Yeah, yeah, I had— I remember like a couple of issues of like Jinx or Torso, I would start getting letters from people whose letters I would read in Captain America, and I'm like, so exciting.

Drew Mollo [00:19:46]: Awesome. Well, and, and maybe this might be a nice time, Kari, if there's any— maybe we want to answer a few questions, you know. Oh yeah, before, before we move on, because let's be real, a lot of conversation and we're, we're gonna get lost in the fan bowl pool.

Mahanna Jade [00:20:01]: The kitty—

Brian Michael Bendis [00:20:02]: this is a lot of kitty heads and a lot of kitty talk here.

Drew Mollo [00:20:06]: There you go. And real kitty.

Mahanna Jade [00:20:08]: This is one of them. This is Sadie. I have TARDIS sheep around here somewhere.

Drew Mollo [00:20:14]: So, Kari, did you have any— do we have any questions?

Kari Sanders [00:20:18]: Um, yeah, we can go through. Um, some of these are just kind of off and about, so I'm gonna go with the stuff that we didn't cover so that when we go into the stuff that we did cover, we'll bring those up later. Um, but first off here, how did you decide to bring Squirrel Girl into New Avengers? Uh, he has a crush on Squirrel Girl.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:20:37]: I, um, I'm very happy about that. I will say this, this is one of my favorite memories at Marvel because I did come— I did have The idea was I had multiple children quickly, and we, for the first time ever, we needed help. And we had a nanny in our house when our kids were little. And I was like, oh, the nanny dynamic was new to me. And like in my house, I'm like, oh, Jessica and Luke would have a nanny, would need a nanny, but you need a nanny probably with superpowers. Like if you're in that space, you need a lane. And so I went to everyone. I was like, hey, I need, It would be cool if it was someone we knew, like, invent someone new, right? But like, it would be cool if it was someone in the Marvel Universe who needed a gig, right? Like, like, you know, I needed a nanny.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:21:22]: And we ended up on Squirrel Girl. I mean, I, I believe like Tom Reaver might have said like, give me 3 names, like Rocket Racer, like, like, like, like names that would come up. And, and Squirrel Girl just like immediately popped up. Like, oh hell yeah, Squirrel Girl's it. Now we made a like a teasing, like we were going to announce who the nanny was at like Wizard World Chicago. It made it like— it was definitely in Chicago. And we're going to announce at the panel who the nanny is. And we announced Squirrel Girl with some like, like almost ironic fanfare, like, because really she would not been on a— in a comic in many years.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:22:01]: And we announced Squirrel Girl. The applause in my memory was so loud and sustained that I started looking around the room because I thought Stan Lee walked in. Yeah, this can't possibly be for Squirrel Girl, but I was wrong. It was 100% Squirrel Girl-related enthusiasm. I was very like— I almost, almost cried. Yeah, it was, it was really, it was really—

Drew Mollo [00:22:26]: you probably didn't realize that you crashed the Great Lakes Avengers panel. And upon, you know, mentioning that, everyone's like, yes! And you're like, oh, apparently this was the right place. Okay, good. Nice.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:22:39]: Hey, Yeah, I'm happy about it. I know, uh, I know it was always controversial. I, I enjoyed it immensely. It's my favorite line of dialogue I wrote between Luke and Jessica about Squirrel Girl, where I think he says she's half squirrel and she, and she says you're half nuts. And I don't know why that made me so happy, but it did.

Drew Mollo [00:23:00]: So it was so good. Um, thank you. Dear God, I completely forgot about it. Now I remember exactly the comic, and I seem to remember there was a little tension between her and Logan.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:23:11]: And I'm just like, it's so funny. It's one of those little bits, and I did a lot where I just drop a little Easter egg that could mean like just a little, oh, hello Logan, like there's a history there and we don't say what it is. And then you get to hear everyone's opinion of what they think it is. And I've done a couple times where like you don't see the kiss, then the audience tells you what they thought happened, like, where their imagination went. And I'm like, oh, okay, I didn't write that, but okay. Like, I don't want to say you're mad at me for what you're thinking, but you're thinking of that all by yourself. I didn't— right. Yeah, which is okay.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:23:49]: I, I do it on purpose.

Kari Sanders [00:23:51]: I call this Claremontisms, when you go ahead and you drop something that can be, like, 30 years later you can say, like, oh, so that comment was actually— I'm writing an issue here about that.

Drew Mollo [00:24:01]: Yeah. We've been making that joke, and I think we're kind of terrified that one day we're going to meet him and be like— it was like, I don't know, am I going to drop a Claremont is? I'm like, oh my God, he pays attention to our podcast. I'm both excited and extremely terrified at this point.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:24:16]: You haven't had him on?

Kari Sanders [00:24:18]: You know—

Jar Jar Jeremy [00:24:19]: No.

Drew Mollo [00:24:19]: Not yet.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:24:20]: All right, you should ask him.

Drew Mollo [00:24:23]: Well, we have to block out at least 3 hours. You know, it's basically— I kind of feel Chris Claremont is like if The Iliad was a person. Just, you know, like one little detail, 17 pages for that one detail in Achilles' Shield, you know. And then it's just like, well, here was that one story I've always wanted to do, Wolverine back in the Outback era, and page, you know, panel 4. And I'm just like, I mean, Chris, if anyone's going to do it, it's going to be you, buddy. Like, you have to have somebody ready to shout Krakoa in the background to make him go No, it's certainly particularly— I've never— oh, it's okay. He already has marked one of our members for immediate dismemberment, but because he did the silliest thing, he mistaked him for, uh, Walt Simonson.

Jar Jar Jeremy [00:25:14]: Oh my God.

Drew Mollo [00:25:14]: Yeah, at a panel. And I was just like— the thing is, Brian, Leo came up to me. I'm sorry, Leo, I didn't— I'm sorry, it wasn't going to be Jar or me. And he was like, I did something really bad. I'm like, what did you do? Like, did the camera explode again? Like, what, what's going on? He was like, we're at the panel. It was the Fantastic Four panel, and I asked the question, and I kept calling Chris Claremont Walt.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:25:36]: And I'm like, Walt, you were calling him Walt? I'm like, you don't look like Walt, Leo.

Drew Mollo [00:25:40]: No, no, no. But it was— and I was like, no, Leo, it's a little more than that.

Kari Sanders [00:25:45]: I—

Leo Pond [00:25:45]: yeah, because we, we essentially— TrekCon is our home for the whole weekend. We have a couple booths, and, uh, you know, we kept on bumping into Chris and for some reason, you know, I, I, I had a heart condition that weekend, so I'm using that as a, uh, as a— yeah, yeah, yeah, uh, but yeah, for some reason I kept on calling him Walt every time I bumped into him.

Drew Mollo [00:26:07]: And then he glared at him the whole panel too. He got that apocalyptic death stare. Just the—

Kari Sanders [00:26:16]: really?

Mahanna Jade [00:26:17]: I have not— I've not heard this.

Drew Mollo [00:26:19]: Yeah, it, it was MJ, I think it was in between your Gambit and Zatanna. You were okay transitioning, you were going from Marvel to DC, so you know, once you cross that universal boundary, you know.

Kari Sanders [00:26:34]: Um, I'm gonna bring up some more of the questions.

Drew Mollo [00:26:37]: Yeah, I'm sorry, what'd you say, MJ?

Mahanna Jade [00:26:42]: I said, I just cosplay— cosplay Grimmin right here, so I love Squirrel Girl so much. Someone, you should do a Squirrel Girl. I'm like, you know what, she was such a fun character and I had so much fun. I make a lot of my own things. The most fun thing I've ever had to make thus far is that giant squirrel tail.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:27:00]: Yeah, yeah.

Mahanna Jade [00:27:01]: And I attached it to my jacket so that when I took, you know, because I had to be able to draw, you know, get in the car and things like that. And I had one— I had a blast running around cons as Squirrel Girl.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:27:12]: That's awesome.

Drew Mollo [00:27:13]: Well, yeah, you're the most— you're the most adorable OP character in all of Marvel. Like, literally everybody is terrified of you. Even Thanos is like, uh-uh, not doing that.

Mahanna Jade [00:27:24]: People would stop me to have me just run.

Kari Sanders [00:27:27]: Hey, the Squirrel Girl!

Mahanna Jade [00:27:28]: Like, they were like, here, photobomb my— they were like, look like you're photobombing my, my, my, um, my photo. So there's so many people that's got a random Squirrel Girl in the background, like doing something ridiculous in the background.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:27:39]: Well, yeah, MJ, have you experienced— like, for, for the comic creators, cosplay can be just the most beautiful expression of love and affection towards what's going on in the story. And, and like, I, I, I have found myself sometimes overwhelmed by— like, the first time someone showed up in like a handmade Miles Morales costume, I— yeah, I'll, I'll burst into tears. It is, it is a really beautiful experience.

Mahanna Jade [00:28:06]: I cosplay a lot and it's a passion of mine. And I was— I was— I built— I've been building things a lot longer than— longer than I have been suiting up. So now I finally get to suit up and it's just a wonderful experience all the way around.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:28:21]: Yeah, it really is. That's just, you know, cosplayers, if it's like among my peers, we're always talking about how it's such a— it's such an overwhelming, beautiful experience because you go into how much time it took for you to make your tail And what a magnificent, lovely thing that is. And that's not one of the things you think about when you're thinking about what will it be when I'm writing comics. And then you get there and it's like, oh, I'm overwhelmed by this connection that we're having.

Drew Mollo [00:28:49]: And then Brian, you're legendary for being rooted to the spot, like wanting to give everybody their 10 seconds. Like I've heard that— I've talked to people who have like worked with you at cons and whatnot, and they're like, oh yeah, he's a machine, man. He won't eat. He barely— he, he is— he sits, he talks to everybody, he will sign whatever, he will take the photos, he will say something about everybody waiting in line. He does not care if the lights are blinking. That man is making sure everybody who has a book of his, who has something to say to him, good or not, will be heard. And I'm like, that in the Yiddish term, that's a mensch right there.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:29:31]: Well, and again, you mentioned Walt Simonson earlier, that when I was 12 years old, Walt Simonson did that to me and he completely changed my life. He did not have to. He just absolutely stopped what he was doing and took me seriously for a few minutes. And it— and it— that was it. I was in comics. And I had other— because some other creators did that for me as well in the years. George Perez. And who were just like, took a minute And it just all I needed to like keep going for like a year.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:29:56]: So when I'm in line with people, A, number one, you did me the honor of buying some books. Oh my God, I can't believe— I'll never get over it. It never gets old. So you're sitting there going, the least I could do was like stop what I'm doing and talk to you for a minute. But also I'm like, one of you might be a young creator who just needs a minute to hear the thing you needed to hear. And if I can get you from A to B, that's what you're supposed to be doing. Like, that's, that's also— I've had the other experience. I've had creators shut me down as a child, shut me down as an adult when they didn't have to.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:30:28]: They were just like, you know, like, right, you know, not their best selves. And it's heartbreaking. I've seen creators do it to other kids. Nothing drives me more nuts than watching a creator just like, just like think they're better than what's going on in the room. And it just drives me nuts. I hate it. So yeah, I'll, I'll, I'll— and also, we're here. This is, this is the moment we're having.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:30:52]: Let's, let's do it, you know?

Drew Mollo [00:30:54]: Um, yes, everybody watching Priest Plus, press like for Brian Michael Bendis because that was beautiful. And we're gonna send him a, a splash pages version of an Emmy. It's gonna be very low budget, but it'll be for you. Um, because that was profound. I almost cried. Did you see that, MJ? Literally real tears down my face.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:31:12]: Mean, you had it in New York?

Mahanna Jade [00:31:14]: I just— yeah, so like I said, it's because of writers and comic book creators that I have anything to go on. Like, honestly, when you really— I come from halfway, literally halfway across the world, you know. We, yes, we have cons and things, but not nearly as many as we have here in the United States.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:31:31]: Um, and it's just— well, I'll tell you another funny— I've had the other version too, where I'm able to do. A woman came up to me in a black leather jacket with her black hair and jeans and a flask, and I went, man, that is some kick-ass Jessica Jones cosplay. And she was like, who's Jessica Jones? I get a lot of people ask me somewhere with cosplays.

Mahanna Jade [00:31:57]: I'm like, uh, you know, fine, it's fine.

Leo Pond [00:32:00]: Yeah, uh, before Kari brings up a question, just, uh, two really quick. Uh, these are more locations. So Jeff is asking, uh, if you're going to be in Australia in the near future for a comic convention. Uh, we're getting some huge names, great vacation space. Also on the Reddit side, uh, Scarlet Spider is asking if you're ever gonna come to Florida Super Con, uh, and if he comes back to Marvel full-time. Uh, okay, so yeah, asking if you're going to Florida, would go to—

Brian Michael Bendis [00:32:30]: well, I have, I have been Australia a couple of times for conventions. I had literally life-changing, magnificent times. I don't think Armageddon exists anymore. It was a, it was a show that took place in Australia and New Zealand that kind of teamed up to get bigger creators over there. So you spent like 2 weeks in the, in Auckland and in Melbourne or Sydney. And my God, I had the best time. I, in Auckland, New Zealand, I rented a bike and I drove so far into the Shire. That I was like, oh, if I get a flat tire, I am like, I am fucked.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:33:04]: Like, there's like no way home. So you're gone. I, I had also like just magnificent experiences with the creators that I was with there. It just was life-changing. I would go back to Australia in a heartbeat. I was, I was there when my, my child was little and George Takei was the like the lead guest of the show and he was so sweet. He like knocked on our hotel door because my daughter was sick from the plane and he went to check on her.

Drew Mollo [00:33:32]: Oh my God, George Takei, are you—

Brian Michael Bendis [00:33:36]: that's what's only funny too is that like he was constantly—

Drew Mollo [00:33:40]: guys, one at a time please—

Brian Michael Bendis [00:33:42]: he was constantly holding my baby and it was a little Olivia and, um, and we all called her Baby O. And you know, he has that voice, it was Baby O, like it was really like— and because she was so little His voice was so overwhelming to her. My daughter was like, get me the fuck away from this guy, I can't. Like, his voice was overwhelming her. She was crawling over his neck to get away from him. It was so funny. It was such a—

Drew Mollo [00:34:06]: yeah.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:34:07]: And I'm about to— I can't say how, but I'm about to return the favor to George Takei.

Drew Mollo [00:34:12]: Oh God, the foreshadowing.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:34:16]: Foreshadowing. You'll hear about it. All right, a project that's not announced yet, so I can't.

Drew Mollo [00:34:22]: Oh, okay, fair.

Kari Sanders [00:34:23]: Yeah, I wanted to throw out one thing real quick, jumping back to the cosplay. Something is playing music around here and it's not me.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:34:32]: Is it the squirrel?

Kari Sanders [00:34:35]: I don't know, it's apparently Alexa. But, um, yeah, so no, the thing about cosplaying was, uh I was in Maspill's first cosplay, and it was the first time I'd ever cosplayed. And so this was this last year at Terrificon. Um, I dressed up as his character the Coney, which is based partially off of his mother, and like, it built it all and had a friend of mine make the mask and everything. And like you were saying, he was just like— I was like, I was the first person who ever cosplayed one of his characters. He's like dragging me down to like, Howard, Howard, look at her! She's dressed like this, and this is why she did this, and this is why this is like this. And it was like, it was like the best moment to have. Like, I'm like, I'm the first time I've ever cosplayed, and I'm your first cosplay.

Kari Sanders [00:35:22]: So we were like for each other's firsts, but it was, well, it was really pretty cool.

Drew Mollo [00:35:26]: Well, but yeah, but that, but that's the thing that I love about conventions is it's basically Halloween and Christmas all together. Any— so many things First, everyone's dressing up. Whether you're— whether you are physically in costume, mentally you're in costume. Um, and then anything can happen, you know. You can meet the celebrity, have this great moment, tell this joke, and like, oh my God, that's so funny. You can meet a comic creator who you really love and you say, man, I loved your work, and like, oh my God, thank you so much. Like, you can meet a cosplayer who, you know, uh, who just very memorable, and then a year or so later they end up on your show. Like, I was like, oh my God, how'd that happen? I am still— I still can't you know, and it's just, you never know, but every day is different.

Drew Mollo [00:36:14]: And it's just like, it, it's so wonderful that I, that I think you cannot describe it properly to somebody.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:36:24]: You have to go to one. It's really magical.

Mahanna Jade [00:36:28]: It feels like you belong.

Kari Sanders [00:36:29]: Yeah.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:36:30]: And it happens, um, behind the table too. Every, every minute of a convention can be magical, or and meeting heroes or people who you're going to absolutely adore. Um, yeah, it's just, it's an incredible experience. There's a thing that's going on in LA now, I think every year, that Patton Oswalt's putting on, the Revenge of Pinball, put together like this outdoor signing thing where like 50 of us show up to just sign stuff. And it is one of the— and it's just comics, nothing else, just—

Drew Mollo [00:37:01]: oh my God, yes.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:37:02]: And my God, oh, that's awesome.

Drew Mollo [00:37:05]: Guys, we need to find where this is and we need to book a hotel. My favorite—

Brian Michael Bendis [00:37:09]: New Hampshire. Me, Mark Waid, Kelly Sue, Geoff Johns— it's just the list went on and on and on. David Mack was there. Just— I, I can't list everybody, but it was just like, you know, me and Cody Ziegler getting to sign Miles Morales together. Just like this. Oh my God, everything about it was just magical. Yeah, and it's like me meeting a bunch of creators I would never see. And, and I don't know, it just had like a real Woodstock feel to it.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:37:34]: I just, I hope they keep going forever and ever. It was the best feeling.

Jar Jar Jeremy [00:37:36]: Yeah, don't eat the brown acid.

Kari Sanders [00:37:39]: I'm gonna drag us back to some more of the questions that we have going because we're, we're neglecting them. Okay, so back to Jeffrey. Um, I have just read your Uncanny X-Men run. I'm actually loving the current X-Men series. What else do you think needs to be done to fix it back to what it was in the '90s?

Brian Michael Bendis [00:37:56]: Well, that's, that's a loaded question that you think. Yeah, fixed. I think with the X-Men in particular, mentioning Claremont, it was like taking over X-Men when Claremont did 40 years of just about every idea you can think of, just like, and trying to come up with a, a new take. I was gifted a new take when I walked in with the original X-Men coming forward in time to experience what the X-Men become. That was an idea that was floating in the room room for years before. I just, as a fan, kept asking, hey, what are you guys going to do that original X-Men Days of Future Past idea? That's a great idea. And then when it was my turn, they were like, yeah, you can have it. I'm like, oh, what a gift.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:38:38]: Yeah, because no one, no one had landed on it. But, um, I think the, the best thing X-Men can do, and really any franchise, but X-Men in particular, is, is look for— look forward, talk about the moment in time that we're in, not the moment in time that we were in. And like, every time there's like a rewind, whether it be in television or movies or in the comics. It's a— it can— it's a kind of a minefield because now you're like trying to recapture the glory days of Death of Phoenix when you should be looking for your— what, what, what would matter to these characters right now, as, as powerful as that meant to them in that moment. So that's always my advice is like, look, look forward, look forward to break stuff. Just like everyone who you liked did when they were writing the book. But it's hard because some of this stuff is so beloved and you want to touch it and you want to like add to be additive to it. But you know, I think the reason House of X was so successful was because it was not— no one else had done that, you know, right? Like it was, and yet it was very much X-Men.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:39:39]: You didn't go, what is this? Like, you're like, oh, okay, new take, all right, here we go. So like a lot of, you know, Like even watching my friend, uh, Fraction on Batman, you know, like just like, yeah, just focus on the moment. Don't, don't, don't worry about the 50 years that came before, you know.

Drew Mollo [00:39:57]: Uh, actually, Kari, I'd like to speak for Brian in a separate answer. I'll like TL;DR that, Kari, the answer is how to do that is clearly synthesizers. You need more synthesizers and Jim.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:40:09]: Well, '90s is guitar. '90s.

Drew Mollo [00:40:11]: Yeah, exactly. You need synthesizers, you need guitar. And you just need a fantastic theme song that will resonate through the fans for generations to come until it inevitably comes back and is still Aces. That is the answer of how we can do that. Thank you very much for coming to my TED Talk, Bendis and me.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:40:28]: Thank you. Well, just these longer franchises like X-Men and Spider-Man, they tend to like be like SNL, where whoever you were as a teenager is your favorite. Like, wherever you were at a certain age, that's yours, right? Like, like, late SNL documentaries talk about all the time, like, whoever you were growing up watching, that was your SNL, right? Yeah, it's true. That's not— it's not like overall general, but it does kind of— but it kind of does land that way.

Drew Mollo [00:40:59]: So, and it's funny because I swear anytime I'm reading Spider-Man, I think, I think that's 100% accurate, because anytime I'm reading Spider-Man, it's either you or Dan Slott.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:41:08]: Because those are the ones— that's nice because we were like two sides of the coin at the same time. We were both, you know, you know, burning hot at the same time.

Drew Mollo [00:41:17]: Yeah, well, it's funny because— and I've told everybody this— like, I had two comics when I was like getting— I, I grew up in comics like MJ grew up in comics, reading everything, and then I kind of fell off, um, and I was that weird kid in school who I seem to recall, oddly enough, web-slinging through the hallways. Um, because, you know, Sam Raimi Spider-Man was very big when I was in high school, and I was at my comic shop and I saw issue 100 of Ultimate Spider-Man. I've never read anything you did like that. I picked that up. Wow, this is great. I'm just picking it up. I was like, are there more? Like, they said 100, what about the other 199? And they're like, oh yeah, no, it's been going on for a while. You should read it, it's great.

Drew Mollo [00:41:56]: Brian Michael Bendis is killing it. You should read the Ultimate Universe. And I never went back. It was so good. So what's it—

Brian Michael Bendis [00:42:03]: what's interesting too now is that like when I was coming up, there was definitely a sense of what was new and what was old, and now there's definitely a sense like, like there's just comics. There's definitely a classic comics, but like there's people reading my Daredevil, they don't know it's 25 years old. Like I hear from them all the time, like they're picking up a trade, they, they don't know what date it originally published. They're just— you're just reading it. And that, right, I did not perceive coming. Like, I was trying— I was, I was like, we talk about— me and my peers talk about this, like, the creators in the '50s and '60s and even '70s didn't have a sense that this stuff would still be in print. Like, you could tell from some of the choices that, like, you know, just getting Jimmy Olsen out the door— he's a lizard, he's a turtle, he's a— you know, you can see that this wasn't meant for collection. And now we kind of know this might be— this might be in print long after I'm gone.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:42:57]: Let's try to like not write anything that'll age it poorly or references that'll date terribly, you know. Just like if you can't be 100%, but like we kind of have a knowledge now that this stuff is going to be collected in different forms over years and repackaged. And yeah, and now we're here and it's fascinating. People really can't I have people reading my Avengers stuff in omnibus form, first time. It's new to them. They don't, they don't see it as the day it was published. They just read comics. I, I love it.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:43:29]: I did not see it coming, but I love it.

Leo Pond [00:43:31]: Yeah, well, in the, uh, in the comic communities, like on Reddit, you know, uh, all of us, you know, we, we collect the floppies, you know, we got boxes behind us, you know, and Jar Jar has them on the wall there. He does. You know, but, uh, going to those communities, just seeing, uh, you know, and it's wonderful, a lot of, uh, young new readers showing off their collection, and it's all trades, you know.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:43:55]: Yeah, most of our audience is trades. It really is. And that's great. I, I don't care how you're reading it as long as you pay for it.

Drew Mollo [00:44:03]: And it, it's funny because, like, again, I, I remember going to cons, and like, if you showed up with a big stack of books, like, that was like the coolest thing. And like, oh my God, thank you so much. I mean, Like, I'll never forget one time, uh, I was seeing the late great Peter David at a New York Comic-Con, and I just had this huge stack because at the time he had survived one of his strokes. Um, and I was like, oh my God, like, are these writers— are not immortal? There could be an end. Like, Peter David is at it. So I did this huge stack. He just saw me standing there at this stack like this big, and he just said, holy shit. Yeah, he's just banging it out.

Drew Mollo [00:44:42]: And Peter David's just And I'm just like— and I remember the great Mark Bagley did something similar, and I had all everything you and Mark did from Ultimate Spider-Man, and he was such a champ. I love that, just signing. And I was telling him like my favorite arcs, like my favorite moments, like everything, and he was just so appreciative and whatnot. And I was just like, you know what? And I saw my friends like, you don't see this anymore. Like, it's so hard now. Um, and it's just— it's still like— like you said, I remember those moments so nicely. And this— it meant the world talking to creators like you and just showing, like, I really love this book. Like, this book was amazing.

Drew Mollo [00:45:26]: I rant about it. I mean, you can ask all of these guys, I'm always raving about Ultimate Spider-Man is the perfect gateway to a new reader. I was like, just read this It's not, you know, 616 canon, but it's still fucking entertaining. Like, it's, it's still great.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:45:46]: Um, you know what else is great? When someone comes up— I, I love the big pile. It's the, the biggest gift of my life when someone comes up and they've got like all of it.

Drew Mollo [00:45:55]: And, and, oh, you're gonna regret that if I meet you again.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:45:58]: But moving on, my guilt kicks in when someone comes in with 6 omnibuses that they drag their ass through a convention with. Like, these big bricks. Like, it's like, I, I have guilt. And then it's always like, right after him, the guy will have just the sleeves. Like, he was smart enough, I'm not bringing the whole book, I'm bringing the sleeve. And the guy with that, it's kind of smart. Yeah, but it's always a guy with the 6 bricks goes, fuck, I should have just done that. But I will say, to this day, and a lot of people said this, but it like when someone comes up to you with one book that looks like they wiped their ass with it, like they've read it so many times it's barely being held together by a staple, and you could see that's how much it means to them, they're going to read it 10 more times.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:46:42]: Oh, it's— oh, I get— I— and they always look the most embarrassed, like they know their book isn't mint. And I'm like, oh no, that's better than mint, that's super mint, that's— that's— it's, you know, right?

Jar Jar Jeremy [00:46:54]: It's the best. Those books smell the best too.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:46:57]: Yeah, they absolutely do. And I had— and also, like, going back to your talk about, uh, Ultimate Spider-Man #100, I had those too. I had, like, this is like pre-internet and pre— like, when I was a kid, I pick up a random issue of Marvel Team-Up where Spider-Man's on the fucking moon, and I'm like, how do you get on the moon? And like, there's no way to— like, there's no Googling, there's no, like, you know, there's no Reddit. There's just like I gotta just think about it, right? And then, and then maybe a year later you'll be at a back issue, oh, it's the one before, this is how we got on the moon. And it's always, you know, so I, I think about that experience in our version of it, like the modern version of it, in the, in the, in the cliffhangers when we're doing our cliffhangers.

Drew Mollo [00:47:38]: I, I just want to say one more thing, and then Kari, I think we should definitely get to some questions. And I, guys, I apologize, I'm fanboying a little bit. I realize it. You're gushing. Um, I also— one other thing I want to thank you for is I at one point was writing for Screen Rant, and, um, they didn't have a lot in terms of backlog for Ultimate Universe, and they were like, yeah, do you want to like write some stuff and everything? And I was like, you're gonna pay me to write about one of my favorite universes in comics? I was like— so I literally went through like every story arc of Ultimate Spider-Man, like you and Mark Millar's, uh, X-Men, all these things. And I'm just pitching ideas like, oh yeah, this is good, this is good, this is good, this is good. So at one point, I think my goal was trying to be like the, the aficionado, like the world expert on the Ultimate Universe. So, so many times that Ultimate Universe was referencing anything, it was one of my articles.

Drew Mollo [00:48:30]: And literally, I was like, look, I'd like to thank Brian Michael Bendis, Mark Millar, uh, Brian K. Vaughan, Uh, uh, the Kuberts, uh, Mark Bagley, just everybody. Thank you so much. That's awesome.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:48:44]: And also, you know, I could definitely feel when Hickman started his Ultimate Spider-Man, there was like a wave of, well, what's also Ultimate Spider-Man? And so that's when articles like yours really kick in for people, like a space. So like, someone cleanly described the last 20 years to me. It is a very— it's a gift. So thank you. Because I, I get those all the time. I get people referencing them to me all the time. Yeah, it's good. Okay, welcome.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:49:09]: So yeah, I like— oh, you talk about like when I was growing up, there was like these like fanzines and like Fantico would do like, like Frank Miller's Daredevil and unpack it, right? And now that's what you're doing here. Like you're doing your version of it here. And I, I love that this, um, extended conversation past the page is always Yep, there we go. I'm sorry, hearts everybody!

Kari Sanders [00:49:34]: Oh no, I'm just— I'm working on getting us through some of these questions. Good people took the time to come and visit us, and they took some time on Reddit to hop in. Um, so I'm gonna go over real quick on, uh, actually, I, I like one of the questions that we have right here in the stream. Um, while we're talking about Miles, uh, we need a Miles and Gwen alternate universe 6-issue series. Your miniseries by Bendis.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:50:02]: So that's nice.

Kari Sanders [00:50:04]: Is that something that, that you would consider, that you would think would be fun to do?

Brian Michael Bendis [00:50:09]: I, um, I, I— you guys know I'm, I'm back doing Marvel stuff. I'm not going to be like I was on multiple monthlies like that. That mountain is absolutely climbed, and I, I have to remind myself all the time that like, you— whatever I was trying to prove, I proved, so stop. And so I have some curated projects that I will be doing, um, them over the next couple years, and I'm, uh, excited to show you what they are. Is that a non-committal answer? But like, me and Sarah Pacelli, wink, are reunited for a major project past Superman. Oh yeah. And so, yeah, okay.

Kari Sanders [00:50:50]: So, so that comes up with— I have two more questions, and these are from Reddit. Um, the first one here is, uh, well, actually, I'll ask them in reverse order. This is from Not a Robot 1984. Do you have any plans on writing more Miles after the upcoming crossover? Yes. Yes. And yes, I just want to get his name in there.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:51:15]: So may I say that I, I think, like, um, when I left Marvel, I did like say out loud and write to some creators who want to hear it, uh, you have my permission to fuck all this shit up. Like, like, I, I made, I made hay out of my time, like, and I did break a lot of stuff and put it back together. And that's kind of what the job is, right? And I know that there were some places that they were like, they were being a little more precious than others. And I thought Miles was entering that space where like And I just let everybody know, nothing would delight me more than you break everything I built and do something with it, because that's what this is supposed to be. In that mindset, Cody Ziegler, who is the last writer of Spider-Man, just delighted the shit out of me with every choice he made, because like, it was, it was literally choices I know I would never get to. And I was like, oh, this is fantastic. So I'm excited to revisit the characters with Sara, Miles's birth mom, and reevaluate our relationship to the characters with a new story. So that'll be down the line, right? Coming right away, coming soon is Spider-Man/Superman with Miles and Clark Kent/Superman meeting each other for the first time, drawn by Sara.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:52:39]: It was having just spent time with Superman and spent time with Miles. In a million years, I never saw the day coming where I'd get to write the two of them speaking together. So I'm excited for that to come out. I'm very happy to be part of that project, even a little bit. And, uh, but, um, just a couple months ago, I got to go to Italy for a little bit of a tour, and I got to reunite with Sarah, who again had a magnificent collaboration with, but we weren't like close friends. She's a— she doesn't speak English as her first language, but we just got along great, and we made a baby, and the baby went out in the world, and it's like way out of our hands. Anything we were— whatever we were hoping for, it's way beyond what any dream we could possibly had, to the point where it's hard to even talk about. Yeah, but it's hard to even talk about.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:53:31]: Like, like, it's like watching your, your child like go off and just just achieve all things. And so we got together in Italy and did have a moment where we were able to go, huh, what? Yeah, and it was kind of great. So we're gonna— we're reuniting with that energy and bringing it forward when we can.

Leo Pond [00:53:55]: Oh, Kari, actually, while we're on the subject, and I know, you know, you can't reveal too much about it, but the Spider-Man/Batman work that we're all about to read soon. How did you approach that? I mean, it's—

Brian Michael Bendis [00:54:10]: Spider-Man/Superman. Spider-Man/Superman, yeah. How did that relate to that one?

Kari Sanders [00:54:15]: I have a direct question about Spider-Man/Superman, actually, about Sara Pichelli. Sure. It was— this is from Beat Bop Boop with multiple—

Brian Michael Bendis [00:54:27]: Oh, I know Beat Bop Boop. —numbers.

Kari Sanders [00:54:29]: You know, people often— but you— that's— they ask, what can you say about your Spider-Man Superman story with Sarah Pacelli? I noticed Superman is wearing his post-Superman Reborn suit on Pacelli's variant for the issue. Is there a reason for that?

Brian Michael Bendis [00:54:48]: Uh, that, that, that is— there is a navigation between the two companies about what everyone looks like and what everyone sounds like and what everyone does. So The literally the only note we got was, that's the Superman word. Then I'm like, okay. Even though it was so funny when I first came to DC, I had entered a space where this should we bring the trunks back was such a big debate inside the offices. Again, I wasn't there. So when they came to me and said trunks or no trunks, and I said trunks, and they went, ah, it was like screaming and yelling. And like, it was the end of a, a conversation that I had not been privy to This had happened a couple of times in my life where I was asked to be the deciding vote and no one told me I was the deciding vote. And, um, uh, this actually happened to me with the, uh, Andrew Garfield Spider-Man movies.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:55:37]: I got called into a Sony meeting, did not know what the meeting was about. Uh, they sat me down, there was like 40 people at a table. And, uh, the head of Sony just goes, Brian, we have a question for you. And I'm like, I have literally no idea what's going to be said. They go, organic or non-organic web shooters? And I went, oh, non-organic. And though, yeah, like the room exploded like it was a jury decision, like people were slamming books on the table and half the people were happy. And clearly someone had decided this will be— we have a tie and we'll have the deciding vote. And I pointed out that there's no— the non-organic web shooters is more of a character device.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:56:16]: He fixes a problem and with his intellect. It's more interesting, and you've already done the other thing, and it's weird and creepy, so let's do this one. And, and, and, and I, I was able to— I was— I felt I did like a pop culture mitzvah, like I got them to like see the, the light. I'm not always successful when I'm asked those questions, but that one I was successful. And with this one, thank you, I walked into DC and there was— they were yelling at each other about the trunks and the— in their historical value, and I'm like I— historical value aside, I think it looks better with the trunks. I just— I think aesthetically it looks good, and, uh, and it's what I grew up with, so I can't not, not see the Christopher Reeve costume, you know. So, um, so that was it. But for this, God bless, there's only a couple shots so you don't see him, you know, waist up, so we're fine.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:57:06]: You can draw— you have my permission to draw the trunks on if they're offensive to you.

Kari Sanders [00:57:11]: Isn't it insane how like this comic book community— like, it's not just Superman. It's like we have this whole thing, this, this whole battle, and it's— and people get angry and will rage each other.

Mahanna Jade [00:57:23]: Oh God, yeah, for where you wear their underwear.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:57:27]: It's just like, I don't mind the conversation at all. It's only when they start treating comic creators like they're the villain in the story because you're not getting exactly what you want the minute you wanted it, or the thing that you had when you were a kid. They suddenly— it gets a little abusive sometimes where you're like, hey, no, that's a human being who cares. I promise, I don't know a comic creator in the world who doesn't care with their whole heart about what they're doing and the characters that they're writing.

Drew Mollo [00:57:52]: And, and that's— it's funny because we've interviewed people— like, I remember I was talking to the great Ron Mars, and I was talking about like, he got like death threats, and people just would walk up to conventions and just be like, you're fucking killing Green Lantern, you suck so hard. And I'm thinking to myself, okay, number one, this is a human being. Number two, it's a fictional character. I understand you're passionate about it, but all that— where's your Green Lantern? Are you working on the character?

Brian Michael Bendis [00:58:19]: Yeah, well, that's— there's a— there's an ownership, and that's— it's fine. It's very— it's— it starts at a loving place, and that's like— and I, I gotta say, I've never— and I've made a lot of appearances— I've— and I know I get my my shit online. I know I do. I'm not running to it. But I, I must say, no one's ever said a word to my face, like, in, in disrespect. I also think you come up to me, you're like, yeah, um, this is not the energy I'm putting out. Like, there's no, there's no fight here. I'm not gonna, you know.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:58:47]: So no one's ever, ever said anything to me or my friends to our face. And even had people say to me afterwards, I've been talking shit about you, and then I met you, and now I'm sorry I talked shit about you, but I do hate what you did with blah blah blah. I'm like, okay, that's it. Okay, that's nice. Yeah. And also, a lot of it comes from passion. Like, I, I get it. We're like— you should hear us when comic creators, when we all get in a room, it gets really passionate.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:59:12]: Like those Marvel retreats we're talking about, it gets really, really passionate, you know. So we, we're, we're all the same kind of fan. It's just, you know, who had— you know, it's just what we do with energy. Do all the Marvel writers— they do. I'm not part of that circle anymore. I know they just had one. Um, uh, I, I've, I've graduated. I did, I did them for like 19 years.

Brian Michael Bendis [00:59:37]: I, I did a lot of them. So, um, but I— yeah, they do. They get together. I think it's a great tool. I think, I think most of your best memories from both Marvel and DC came out of those retreats. I was at it. I, I mean, I mean, the first one from our generation, they just had us get in a room and went down the list of characters and said— and the, the publisher said, us owning it isn't enough reason to publish it. Why do we publish Iron Man? Why do we publish Fantastic Four? What is it about? Are we telling that story? If not, why not? And what story should we be telling with that character? And that's why I ended up on Avengers.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:00:17]: That's why, like, um, that's where Iron Man Extremis came from. That's where, uh, Astonishing X-Men came from. Like, real, like, like, landmark, like, now moments in those character history came from just, let's go around the table and talk about what these things are and what we're doing. And then it evolved into, hey, let's plan a summer together. And then the Civil War retreat was one of the best retreats I'd ever been to, where we literally spent 3 days talking about something else that wasn't working. And in 4 minutes out of the conversation of this isn't working, Civil War popped right off the other end. Like in 4 minutes, the whole thing came together. Like you hear about songwriters talking about like Dolly Parton saying, I wrote Jolene in 5 minutes, right? Yeah.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:01:01]: But because, because of the 20 years that led up to it. And so being in a room with like 40 writers and it just the, the best idea comes flying out at the end. Incredible. Then I've, you know, watching Jason Aaron build Thor and watching Fraction build Hawkeye, like, at least, or watching Jason build Secret Wars, like, they come in and you watch them from their earliest germ, and then they build and build and build and build, and every— yes, hands it into a space until it's something special. It's— I'll never forget these moments. They're, they're incredible. Just delightful. And also, just, you know, particularly at Marvel, there's a level of mutual respect among the group.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:01:42]: We're not all friends, but there's this level of we're all here to help each other that never went away. And every time I come across a picture from a retreat, which I was actually just recently told to do because Marvel's putting together a book that has some of these memories in them, and we all were, you know, taking pictures. Jerry Dugan taking the best pictures of all of us. And, um, and I'm so glad we have these memories because, like, there was a time in my life where I was in a room with Jonathan Hickman, Jeff Lemire, you know, and Scotty Young just cooking stuff, and there's no other space where that would have ever happened, you know, unless Marvel put us together.

Drew Mollo [01:02:20]: Sounds like the best summer camp ever, Brian. Right?

Brian Michael Bendis [01:02:24]: I want to go to the best—

Drew Mollo [01:02:25]: I want to go to Marvel Retreat. God, that sounds like the best, guys.

Mahanna Jade [01:02:30]: And sometimes for 23 years, I can probably get—

Brian Michael Bendis [01:02:34]: I can cook. But like, like, even like sometimes the debates would be as rough as you would read on Reddit or, oh, um, you know, like, or the wherever, like, you know, like we're thinking about killing a character or they're thinking about like, you know, I remember that Captain America is gonna die, like, oh my God, it was such a passionate conversation. It was great. That was the other funny thing too. You never wanted to leave the retreat because your character might die if you're not there. I remember Ed Brubaker had to catch a flight, and then an hour later at the airport, like, I think they killed it. Yeah.

Kari Sanders [01:03:11]: Who's the biggest troll? If you're talking Reddit similarities, who's the biggest troll?

Brian Michael Bendis [01:03:17]: Well, it depends. I don't necessarily say trolls, but there's definitely like people— like, like there's a couple, uh, creators who would definitely want to like protect their childhood memories, right? And they would hear a story coming along, you could see it was agitating them. I've said a couple things where Tom Brevoort, who was literally the one of the best editors I've ever worked with in my life, but before we knew each other, I remember saying stuff in the room and looking at him like, he's gonna gonna fucking kill me. That guy's gonna say what I just said out loud. And then we ended up being amazing partners, like amazing partners, like to the point where I told Tom that he was such a strong editorial voice in my head that he was still in my head while I was writing Superman. Like I was still like, wow, running ideas through an imaginary AI in my head of Tom Brevoort. Like it was hard to describe.

Kari Sanders [01:04:09]: Yeah, you're like the only person who doesn't have Mark Waid going through their head when you write.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:04:16]: Mark would have been one of those guys. Yeah. But Mark also just coming at it with an expertise and like everyone had a different expertise. Like I was more like emotionally involved with the characters and there, there are people who have the facts of their lives like memorized, you know? So it's, it's that mixture of the group that makes it magical. Does that make sense? You know, and, and, and John's like a methodical planner. Fraction is too, like just like, you know, notebooks full of charts and stuff like that. Or yeah, because everyone comes at it differently. You put them all together, you're gonna get something special, right? And also, you had another question, was that if an idea could survive this room, it can survive the internet.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:04:57]: Okay. I, I, I've had like— I've come in with an idea and like some writer who I barely know will poke a hole in it. I'm like, yeah, that— you're right, that's— I didn't think of that. And or, or add something to it that made it magic. You know, and I'm so grateful because I'm like, boy, the internet would have killed me if that person wouldn't have said that to me right now a year ahead of time, you know. And they would have been right.

Jar Jar Jeremy [01:05:21]: I, I've always wondered with writers such as yourself, because you guys have a daunting task, especially in comic books. You have to keep up with stories from, like you said, like 30, 40, 50, sometimes 50 more years ago. Uh, how do you keep all that straight? Is there somebody you have to go to, or is there like a file system for you guys or something like that?

Brian Michael Bendis [01:05:44]: Well, a few things go on. Also, the— actually, the biggest thing is you're working in the moment of— it's a living, breathing, changing universe. It's a shared universe. Yeah, sometimes dozens of authors working simultaneously moving it forward. So what you don't want to do is be writing in a bubble that doesn't sound like you know what's going on in any other book. Like, you don't have to reference all the other books, but just the idea that you understand what's going on in Captain Marvel or what's going on in Iron Man while you're writing this would be helpful to the, the vibe of it all. So what they did was, um, they started sending us— like, as soon as the books were done, we all get PDFs of them. So we're all like reading like 4 or 5 months ahead of everybody.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:06:27]: So we have like a sense of where things are headed. And also we had heard a lot of these pitches. Like, I— we had heard Jason's Jane Foster pitch for a year or so before it actually became a, you know, a story, right? So we're like, we're all like aware of where what's going. So it's, it's a mixture of like a lot of us must say, not, not to be surprised, but most of the room has some sort of encyclopedic knowledge of some part of the Marvel Universe. Or if you're Mark Waid, you have all of of it, right? So a lot of us are coming in with a lot of information, but with the idea that it's good to have all that information, it's nice to remember what happened to me in high school, but that doesn't affect what's happening in this conversation, right? Yeah. So you want to be present with them and have that information for when it's needed, right? But you don't want to lean too hard on it because then you're just writing, you're just writing on a hamster wheel. You're not, you're not advancing the character in any way, shape, or form. So, so they would be.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:07:26]: And there's like, if you need like, hey, does anyone have a copy of X-Men Annual 3 from 1971? Like, and then you— it'll show up, you know. So you do have access to libraries that you can access if you don't have them all, but most of us have them all, so we, we have our own copies. So yeah, it's— and they're very helpful in that way, and they love to share. And also Tom, Tom is again— and Tom, Nick Lowe, Mark Paniscia. These people are like encyclopedias of knowledge. Like, you know, any— and also, I remember years ago, I've talked about this publicly a couple of times, but John Cleese from Monty Python wrote a book called On Creativity. And he talked about like, there's one time where he was writing a sketch for Monty Python. And then by the time he finished the sketch, when he pulled it out of his typewriter, he went, oh no, I'm not creating— Peter Sellers wrote this.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:08:19]: 20 years ago. I'm remembering. Oh shit, is that a thing we could do? And then I literally said to Tom, you will know better than me if you ever catch me like accidentally writing an old Roy Thomas comic that I think I'm creating but I'm actually remembering. Please tackle me. Like, I got— you can get paranoid about like, wait, am I remembering this or am I creating this? And that's a That's a— that's a— that, that got it— that got in my head for a little bit, but I got it right.

Drew Mollo [01:08:49]: Yeah. Okay, MJ, you had a question?

Mahanna Jade [01:08:54]: No, I think Carol had to—

Kari Sanders [01:08:55]: oh, okay, Kari. Yeah, okay. I'm— good Lord, I have so many questions for you, but I'm taking it over to the audience because they took the time to join us and do everything.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:09:07]: And I'll talk to you afterwards. Thank you for joining us, everybody.

Kari Sanders [01:09:11]: Um, yes. Okay, I, I need to hop on this real quick. Um, I know that you write a lot of like crime fic and such, and there's— there is a lot of unaliving that happens. So, uh, Jeffrey here would like to know, is it okay for superheroes to be killers? Batman and Superman never kill, and I really like that.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:09:30]: So I think canonically Batman has killed, right?

Drew Mollo [01:09:33]: Is that, is that correct?

Brian Michael Bendis [01:09:35]: Yeah, I never haven't killed but I do remember. So yeah, I think these are all, at the end of the day, they're morality plays. They're like Aesop's fables in a way. They're stories about someone learning to be their best selves or what good versus evil is and, you know, how far were you willing to go to protect that which you say you will protect. So for Superman, like, it was my, philosophy that I stole from many other people, that he's the best version of us. He's thinking the best thoughts. Like, it was a great, may I say, a great job to have during the pandemic when it was hard to come up with good thoughts for yourself. But I was forced for many hours a day to think the thoughts of the best person.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:10:19]: It's hard to go to the grocery store and fight with people when you're writing Superman all day. So I will say, I don't see it. No, it's true. So it's such a— you're trying to aspire to this. It's such an aspirational story that it's not like— and I did, I grew up in the '80s and '90s where, like, how far down can we pull these characters? And how rage-filled can they be? And people, like, learning the wrong lessons from Frank Miller's Daredevil, or, you know, and trying to see how aggro they can get with the characters. And I was never really into that at all. And it's always frustrating when people learn the wrong lessons from an excellent idea. Or Watchmen, really, everyone was trying to Watchmen everything.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:11:06]: I'm like, no, not everything needs to be Watchmen. That's not what it's for. And so I had just a different philosophy. And I think, yeah, our idea is that the characters are always faced with a choice and never even Like with Spider-Man, it's— there's never— he's never going to think about it. I'm always going to do the right thing, and if I got to take a— if I got to take a spanking instead, I will. I'll take the hit, right? So that— that's— Spider-Man's always going to make the right choice, or he's not Spider-Man anymore. The end. Yeah, right.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:11:39]: And I was so grateful I had so many people like Jerry Conway that I grew up with reading that had defined this so clearly that there was no question in my mind that that was is the right way to go.

Kari Sanders [01:11:50]: Yeah. All right, next question. Um, I have 3 of these, so after this I have one more out of these. Um, okay, X-Men related. I still love Bendis' run on X-Men. Issue number 13 has one of the best speeches by Kitty Pryde regarding her mutant identity and everything that stands for her and her pride in that.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:12:11]: Yes. Um, uh, that's a Go ahead, I'm sorry, was there more?

Kari Sanders [01:12:16]: Oh no, it's kind of more of a comment, but what would you like to— can you extrapolate?

Brian Michael Bendis [01:12:20]: That was— I, I, you know, people goofed on me for how much Kitty Pryde I put in, but, uh, you know, now with some retrospect, obviously, um, as a Jewish person, I, I saw Kitty Pryde and Ben Grimm as like representation that startled me, right? And, um, there's a lot of, uh, characters that are definitely coded Jewish from their creators and the way they act. Spider-Man And, um, that, that the Jewish people can definitely see— well, that, that's— I don't care what anyone said, that's, that's Stan. That's, that's, that's Stanley Lieber as Peter Parker. And, um, so, so with Kitty Pryde, particularly because I was at that age when Claremont introduced her, and because she kind of was like a not formed, fully formed character, she was like figuring it out on page as we went, I just was delighted by her. So, because I was a little Jewish person trying to figure it out as I went, so I couldn't wait to express that, my feelings about that with that character. And then when I got to it, when I got to that page, that, that particular page where she tells a story about she doesn't particularly look Jewish, but so, you know, you know, it's, it's different when you don't look a certain way or represent a certain way, then you're faced with— and that had happened to me. I'd gone on a date with a woman who just got crazy antisemitic, whispering things to me about the Jews. And I'm like, oh my God, should I show her my bar mitzvah pictures? But I, but I, but I had been faced with someone thinking they were safe to be antisemitic with me.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:14:02]: And me being deeply horrified. And so that story she tells happened to me, and it's a very rare occasion in a Marvel comic where I'm actually telling you a true story but through a character, right? And it was— and I was grateful to be able to do it, and I was overwhelmed by the response to that. I couldn't believe how many people, Jewish and not Jewish, were moved or taken or grateful for that page. I was I was, I was, I was, because as many people will tell you, your best work is right on the edge of super embarrassing. And, and I'll tell you, that's a feeling that never goes away. But when you're writing up to the edge of, oh, I don't, I don't know if I should even share this, and then you're, you're right to share it. It makes people feel better and more human. So yeah, so I appreciate that.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:14:50]: Okay, okay.

Kari Sanders [01:14:51]: So this is, this is one from Uh, our good friend Dylan, uh, you, you would make his life basically. Um, would you ever write an Aquaman run?

Brian Michael Bendis [01:15:03]: Well, I wrote a little Aquaman in my, um, uh, pandemic-killed, uh, JLA run. Um, absolutely writing my ass off on JLA. There's no, no stores are open, but, uh, Aquaman was right there. Um, I, at the time I was at DC One of my best friends, Kelly Sue DeConnick, was gifted the Aquaman run, and we talked at great length about what that character is. And I remember Kelly getting to a space with that character that was so deep and so profound that I was like, oh, the right person's writing Aquaman. Like, boy, oh boy, that's it. And it's happened with a few characters where your friend is writing it and they say something about the character that's so profound, you go, oh, I don't even want to— I'm just— this is— I'm putting it out of my mind. I'm not even thinking about this character anymore because it's almost like you feel like it's been solved.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:15:58]: And then again, it's all liquid and it flows as we go. But, um, if you want to see what I think is a great Aquaman run, read Kelly Sue's. That would, you know, that would be my aspiration if I ever did do it. I did meet Jason Momoa. Nice. Oh man, I—

Kari Sanders [01:16:19]: my stepsister is absolutely all adoring, so I keep having to make all these different memes and stuff to send her to just like, when she's down, it's like, here's Jason Momoa rising from the seas to make you happy.

Drew Mollo [01:16:32]: Yeah, there you go.

Leo Pond [01:16:34]: Leo, you had a question? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I know our time is limited, so I want to make sure—

Drew Mollo [01:16:39]: no, no, Leo, don't worry about it.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:16:40]: Just I know, I know, I know.

Leo Pond [01:16:43]: Uh, so, um, I absolutely loved Batman Universe. Uh, it was one of—

Brian Michael Bendis [01:16:47]: thank you, me too.

Leo Pond [01:16:49]: Yes, it was one of the first books, uh, I started collecting when I got back into comics. I was a big, you know, comic collector, you know, in, in the, uh, '90s, early aughts, and, uh, stopped for a while. But anyway, uh, Batman Universe is definitely a, a different Batman, and I love the interaction between, you know, the different characters and, and like the, the The jaunt between the different universes and stuff. Uh, but before that you were doing Superman. Superman, uh, I, I, from what I remember, I think was like a more serious Batman or serious Superman where Batman's more, uh, uh, lighthearted. Uh, what do you think of the, the contrast? You know, what, how did you approach writing that Batman? Uh, and— oops, sorry, go ahead. No, no, thank you.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:17:36]: I— that is one of my favorite things I did at DC, and I'm thrilled that I did it. And I was like bullied into doing it, was kind of gently bullied into doing it. I, I— when I came, when I came to DC, um, again, that, that which was never the plan. I was going to leave Marvel and do what I'm doing now, but then DC got wind of it, and Dan called me and was— literally made me an offer I couldn't refuse. And then like all of you, I know my history of— and so many of my heroes, including Walt Simonson, had gone to Marvel and went to DC for a little bit and went back to Marvel. Like, there was, there was a bit of a, you know, Perez did it, Byrne did it, like Frank Miller did it. Like, so, so to be offered that same path, I, I couldn't— I literally couldn't say no. And then I had like a secret meeting with Dan DiDio where he was like I, I think it was the first, like, new hire they made in a while who didn't, like, ask for Batman right away.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:18:33]: And I, I just, I, like, I wasn't thinking about Batman. And I, and I even thought about later, like, well, why aren't you thinking about Batman? Oh, it's because in high school Dark Knight Returns came out. And I thought, well, that's it, Batman has been— that's it, there you go. Everything, the greatest thing Batman could do has been told. It was literally like Batman, uh, Dark Knight Returns, Batman: Year One, and Killing Joke came out within 12 months of each other. And I was at that age and my brain melted. And that's Batman. And what am I going to— what the fuck am I going to say? Right.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:19:03]: So I had no Batman in me. And also Batman at the time was a very horror-related book. You know, Scott was very much pulling, you know, Joker faces and all that. And I know very successful, but not my vibe, not where I would— I would think to go. So I'm like, I don't have anything to say with Batman. But boy, little Jewish boy from Cleveland would love to write Superman. If that becomes available. And also, I got into an age where I realized that when you raise your hand for a character, you have to be careful because it is someone else's job at the moment, and you don't want to, like, complicate or bully or do anything.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:19:37]: And I, I may have accidentally done that once at Marvel, and it really— I didn't realize I'd done it, and it bothered me a great deal. So I was going to make sure, like, hey, if Superman ever becomes available, I would love a shot, whether it be a mini— like, that, that would cool, right? And then, right, he goes, oh hey, you know, Action 1000 is like 3 weeks after you sign. You— and I'm like, oh yeah, I would love to be in Action Comics 1000. So it, like, it— so it became, I'm gonna do Superman. And even the whole time, Dan's like, I can't believe you want to do Batman. I go, I want to do Superman. I want to do Superman and Legion. I really, really do.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:20:14]: And, and so a few months later, he called me and Tom King and said, you're both going to do these Walmart books. For those who don't know, it was a Walmart promotion for these magazines. And you're going to do— you're going to switch books. You're going to do Batman and he's going to Superman. And I'm like, oh, you're so smart. Like, he's— he wants me to write Batman. And he's kind of like— like, he personally wants it. And so I had— I met Nick Darrington, who had just done amazing work with Gerard Way on the Young Animals imprint.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:20:45]: Right. And And my God, and it was like the perfect voice for what I was deciding was my— like, and I did, I had the same question you asked, like, what's my Batman? Like, where would I want to go? And I spent— and I publicly posted about all of this. I was reading, like, I was rereading the entire DC Universe from scratch. I was like— because it's different reading it as a fan than reading it as a collaborator. You look at the stories differently. And I read this Batman encyclopedia with like all the armors and stuff like that, and they had a little intro by Frank Miller. And Frank Miller said in the intro, and I'm paraphrasing, that, um, one of the only characters in all of pop culture that you can do Lego Batman and horror Batman and the audience goes, yeah, that's Batman, is Batman. But you couldn't do that to any other character.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:21:36]: You go, whoa, whoa, whoa, that's not Spider-Man. Whoa, whoa, whoa, that's not the Fantastic Four. But Batman can seem to be pulled from the silliest version of Batman, which was one of the most popular, to the most serious version of Batman, which was also one of the most popular. You can do the Batman TV show and Christopher Nolan, right? So I'm like, you're like— and it kind of frees you to like think of what your Batman is. I'm like, oh my, it freed me of like whatever he had put on me in the '80s with The Dark Knight Returns. And then I started just writing my Batman. And then about 3 issues into it, I went, I'm writing Brave and the Bold. This is my favorite Batman, is Jim Aparo on Brave and the Bold.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:22:17]: That, that's my Batman. And then, and then I, again, I didn't start thinking this is Brave and the Bold, but like 4 issues in, even like, oh, I'm— this is Brave and the Bold. There's— here's Green Arrow, here's Green Lantern. It's like— and, um, I was so happy, like, immediately Someone wrote, "Oh, so you love Brave and the Bold." I'm like, "Thank you. Yes, you see me. I feel seen." So that was my Batman. But yeah, I was delighted that it hit well because I'm like, we all do like takes that are like against the grain of what's going on in the moment with that character that sometimes are well received and they're darker takes or lighter takes, but this one was well received. So I was grateful.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:22:59]: And, and people were— people were being rough on me then too. Like, people were really— John Kent pissed off at me. So I, I appreciate the, uh, how much people were digging our Batman. Oh yeah, I love it. If you find the trade, pick it up. It's, it's also— it's stunning. It's gorgeous. Dave Stewart, Nick Darrington.

Drew Mollo [01:23:17]: Brian, I just need to say, as a dinosaur fan, the scene where Batman is like, I love dinosaurs, and realize, like, really? It was like, uh, yeah, like, literally, hold on, I gotta read it. It says, I love dinosaurs. You do? Of course I do. Batman loves dinosaurs. I have a giant dinosaur in my Batcave. Oh yeah, I need a cave.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:23:38]: I, I got— she loves enough, we made the background that I, I earned a lot of respect for the dinosaur line that I didn't see coming. I thought it was, you know, we all see the dinosaur in his— he's got a big giant dinosaur in his house. So I was grateful that that line landed well. It really did warm me to people. For Batman fans, there is a podcast behind the Comedy Bing Bang paywall where Bobby Moynihan plays Batman. I've been on this podcast. It is one of my favorite Batman content things that exist in the universe. It is silly as hell.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:24:18]: I've been on it. It was one of the most magical days of my life. Uh, I highly— if you, if you, if you're not familiar with that space, I love that space as a podcast. Um, but that Batman podcast is—

Leo Pond [01:24:30]: I, I, I, I'm a huge Batman fan, so I'll definitely check it out. You'll love it. And you follow up, uh, you know, uh, uh, where he says, uh, uh, dinosaurs, magnificent creatures, like right before they leave. But, um, you mentioned, uh, Lego Batman and, you know, of other forms of Batman. Uh, Jar Jar said, uh, you're a gamer. I don't know if you know, but they're actually merging Arkham Batman and Lego Batman.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:24:56]: Oh, you don't think me and my 13-year-old know about this? You don't think we have—

Drew Mollo [01:25:00]: oh my God, Leo, we have to— excuse me, we have to acknowledge that this man got to live his dream when they were like, hey Brian, do you want to do an Ultimate Spider-Man video game in the early 2000s? He was like, do I? I will write every line of dialogue in this entire mother-flipping game.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:25:22]: I had a great time at a game. It was a great experience. I also got to write the Marvel MMO, which I think is— yeah, hold on, I don't think you keep talking anymore. I also got to write, and this is the best job I've ever had, I wrote an Avengers video game that, um, folded because the company collapsed. But I got, I got I— my contract was fully executed. So yeah, there you go. Yes, I have one of the very few actually. Yeah, if you could Google this on YouTube, you can see there's the defunct Avengers Skrull game where they did like basically a Secret Invasion video game that was better constructed than our comic book, to the point where I was mad at myself because they, they had, they had it constructed where everyone just wakes up one day and the Skrulls have invaded and it— they already won.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:26:09]: I'm like, oh, I should have done that. That's how I should have done it. And so when I did Age of Ultron, that— I, I did that. Like, you wake up and Ultron just took— it just happened while you're sleeping. So anyway, so video games have been very good to me. I love doing them. I've been paid a couple of times for games that never happened, including a sequel to that— to that game. I got hired to write the sequel Ultimate Spider-Man.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:26:36]: And, um, then they realized they didn't have the window with Sony had a movie game coming out, and so they didn't have enough of a window to get our game out. So I had written this whole story, and then that became— excuse me— Spider-Man, like the death of the Hobgoblin storyline. That was what the second video game would have been. Oh wow. Yeah, amazing.

Leo Pond [01:26:57]: Um, what are you playing now with your son?

Brian Michael Bendis [01:27:00]: Uh, well, it was really funny. We, we do a lot of, um, almost nightly we do an after-school relaxing Call of Duty 3 zombie, uh, Kinder Toten, uh, just murdering zombies and just talking about our day. Um, and, uh, and, uh, Indiana Jones. Um, yeah, a lot, a lot of, a lot going on here with stuff. But my son also is like 13, so he's discovering a lot. Of games that he just aged into. Like, he can enjoy Just Cause. Like, he's really, like, really loving it.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:27:34]: So yeah, so I kind of like let him just have the console.

Drew Mollo [01:27:37]: There you go. Yeah.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:27:39]: But I, I will say, like, coming up, like, a lot of us, when we weren't on at a Marvel retreat, me, Ed, Matt, a bunch of other creators would hop on PlayStation and just murder each other in Call of Duty and just talk shop.

Drew Mollo [01:27:55]: In just a lot of amazing—

Brian Michael Bendis [01:27:56]: some of the best moments we ever had. It's like coming up with good ideas with just like being in that— it's, it's like you're not overthinking it, you're just like, you know what I mean? You're like, you're just, you're just talking while you're shooting and killing. Yeah. And a lot of us play games that are not story-based because we spend so much time in story that I just need to be murdering people when I'm, when I'm playing.

Drew Mollo [01:28:18]: Guys, we gotta get back to video games. We need to get back to video games to have the ideas. Um, all right. And I—

Brian Michael Bendis [01:28:25]: the only game I pitched that didn't go through that I really think they blew it was, um, years ago when Simpsons Tapped Out was all the rage. I was like, why is there not a Marvel version of this game where you're just building and building and building? And I, I pitched and pitched and pitched. I could not get them to— I want— I just— because I physically wanted it. And I know about Marvel Rivals and that some of them have some of this now, but I had a very specific, you're going to have an empty New York and you're just going to build it building at a time and building at a time. So, but I couldn't get it going. Wonderful.

Kari Sanders [01:28:59]: I have this terrible issue. I love video games and I can play MMORPGs, but I, I've tried to play some of the other games, like the matchup games, you know, where you like knock out 4 things and then you build up enough to where you can use your power to shoot things. And I am epileptic, and so I have seizures. Oh, really? Yeah. And it's, and it's sad because I can play like World of Warcraft and some of the bigger games because they let you adjust.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:29:25]: But Candy Crush, Candy Crush will get you.

Drew Mollo [01:29:28]: Yeah, I'll knock her out.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:29:30]: Yeah, that's such a safe space for me.

Kari Sanders [01:29:33]: Yeah, it's, it's a little, the little games that like just destroy me. But I'm, I'm gonna grab you since I have this moment here. Um, so I have a question for you about Batman Universe real quick, and this was something that just like, oh, I love that you used Riddler, but, um, you used him to show how the ring was affecting people's minds, and he is such a strong character. So seeing him become feeble-minded and the way he used that as a way of trying to fight back with what he gave to people was wonderfully poetic. Thank you. I am now going to forever be curious as to what happened to him after we last saw him, because time and space changed and came back and went forward, and you just left us hanging.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:30:22]: I believe he became a big movie star and got his own comic written by the actor who, uh, yeah, so, you know, boom, worked out okay. I, I really— some of that is like, oh, there's a big Riddler thing coming, back off. Like, you know what I mean? Like, you know, so, so it— yeah, yeah, just look at the, uh, Paul Dano stuff as, as the, uh, pretty amazing.

Kari Sanders [01:30:48]: He is just such a— like, though, I mean, like, uh, Ollie hates on Batman's rogues gallery like mad, and Joker is considered, you know, the, the ultimate anti-Batman character.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:31:00]: I disagree, but yes, I know.

Kari Sanders [01:31:02]: But I mean, in general, but Riddler is so intensely intelligent in the way that he attacks things. I just love that you chose him as the character to be there for that.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:31:14]: Thank you. I will say, just this week, my son, who's on spring break, uh, experienced Batman Forever for the first time. Oh my God. And yeah, he's 13, and he was furious. He was livid. He goes— because, because also Like, he didn't— like, because remember, that movie is like wrapped around Jim Carrey mania of the time. And you have like, you know, uh, Tommy Lee Jones is actually trying to outdo Jim Carrey in some scenes, which is nuts because that's not his energy. And so my, my son is like, why is everyone acting like the Joker? That's— the Riddler is not the Joker.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:31:48]: Two-Face is not the Joker. And I'm like, let's start your podcast now. Put a microphone— you know what, you're ready.

Drew Mollo [01:31:54]: Yeah, we're gonna do that. You have to quote them. It was like, your entrance was good, his was better. Why? Showmanship.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:32:01]: Um, no, the best quote of that is from behind the scenes, and comedy people talk about it all the time. Oh my God, where Tommy Lee Jones— you can Google this, this is a well-known story, okay— where Tommy Lee Jones and Jim Carrey were put together, and Tommy Lee Jones got a, got a, like, you know, like, like a big, big face of Jim Carrey. And he pulled them aside and goes, just so you know, I do not sanction this buffoonery. That's the best line. Amazing. They did not get along at all.

Drew Mollo [01:32:30]: No, they hated each other.

Leo Pond [01:32:34]: I, I, uh, just real quick, I, I think that's also the movie where they snuck in the holy sheet metal Batman or something like that.

Jar Jar Jeremy [01:32:40]: Something like that. Oh, rusted metal.

Leo Pond [01:32:42]: Oh, holy rusted metal Batman.

Jar Jar Jeremy [01:32:44]: Yeah, it's made of metal.

Drew Mollo [01:32:46]: Yeah. Yeah, it's all the holes. Yeah, all the holes. So I have one more question.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:32:50]: Like a 13-year-old with today's— a 13-year-old with today's sensibility who has experienced the Christopher Nolan franchise and then goes back to experience that, he's like, oh, what the— he would— he was— well, he was apoplectic. It was hilarious.

Drew Mollo [01:33:05]: It was like, what the hell is this? Where's Hans Zimmer?

Brian Michael Bendis [01:33:07]: Who's Seal? What's the smashing? What is this? Not only were we happy to have it how well received it was in the moment, you know.

Jar Jar Jeremy [01:33:18]: There you go, collecting the glasses.

Drew Mollo [01:33:22]: Indeed. Um, so I, I kind of want to bring it back to a Batman Universe.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:33:29]: Yeah, right there. Hold on. Oh, there's a Batman Universe right there. Nice. Look at that. That's amazing.

Drew Mollo [01:33:36]: That's a gift from, uh, Darrington right there. Nice. So my last question, and then I'm done. I wanted to bring it back to Spider-Man, which, again, I love all about Spider-Man. But this is one of my favorite stories. And I always kind of enjoyed reading it, remembering— like, I think it was the great Joe Quesada was like, man, if we ever cross over with the regular Marvel, this is a sign we've run out of ideas. And it was the 50th anniversary. You and Sara Pichelli have 5 issues to just do the mother of all crossovers.

Drew Mollo [01:34:10]: And man, you guys nail it. And it wasn't just— really proud of those. Um, and I, and I, again, every time I rewrite it, I'm still laughing at the same jokes. Whether it's Spider-Man doing the put your hands in the air, wave like I just don't care, dead. Um, admitting how much he hates Mysterio. They just hold hands like, oh my God, no, I hate this guy. Um, and of course the Absolutely hilarious moment with Nick Fury. Um, the— so you're Nick Fury.

Drew Mollo [01:34:37]: Um, he's African-American. Sorry, he's white. Sorry to hear that. Um, amazing, just hands down. But the emotional beats in it are still heartbreaking. Um, uh, Peter meeting Ultimate Aunt May and Gwen, uh, the whole, uh, kind of giving Miles the blessing. And of course the Well, the things you need to know about Spider-Man: clones are bad, don't ever loan money to Wolverine, ever. But the one question I had is I have to ask is I was reading an interview, and I think it was you, you were talking about it, and there was, I think, a moment in issue 4 that Sarah was like, okay, you broke me, I cried.

Drew Mollo [01:35:20]: Do you know what moment it was? Because I've been racking my mind and I'm like, I would love to know What it was, because, because it was—

Brian Michael Bendis [01:35:27]: and it was Aunt May related, I believe. Okay, I believe, I believe it was. I, we had that, you know, for those who have grieved people, like, comic book logic can allow us moments of like clarity and grief for a character that you wouldn't get in real life. Like, you wouldn't get to like meet another universe's version of your, your son and get to hug them one last time, right? Those— or, or to say the one last thing you wanted to say, right? So that's— that, that stuff hit really hard. And it also just speaks to Sara's emotional connection to what she's drawing. Um, also, um, both the Spider-Man miniseries and a lot of the work we're talking about was, um, colored by Justin Posner, who is no longer— and, and he was one of the— the really— when you talk about some of these moments, his ability to bring a richness to the page, um, uh, is second to none. And I miss him terribly. And, uh, um, and we really did become pals from working together on all these projects.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:36:35]: But it did feel like you're working with like a master cinematographer or something, like Roger Deakins, who were like, oh, oh, just, just, just no notes, just do you. And, and, uh, and so a lot of the emotions that you're feeling, that came from choices that he was making with Sarah. And yeah, it's kind of amazing. Yeah, yeah.

Drew Mollo [01:36:54]: And yeah, just want to piggyback, I had the pleasure of meeting Justin once or twice, and he was one of those people, no matter what you brought him, he would sign everything. He was the nicest guy, brushing back the long hair to talk to you, and he was just, again, one of the sweetest, nicest people. So I remember I was all ready to go to con and I didn't even know he had passed, and I had a huge stack ready to go, and I was like, I'm gonna carry this, it's okay.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:37:20]: Like, he, uh, the three— me, David Marquez, and he really like bonded as a team. Like, Justin and I worked on a bunch of projects together, but three of us and stuff was really, um, really some special stuff. So yeah, yeah, thank you for letting me say his name because he's one of those names you're not gonna here unless we, we keep it alive and let people know a lot of those things that you're experiencing in my work came from his, his contribution that, that is still second to none. It's incredible. Absolutely. So my pleasure. Yeah, yeah, I will, I will. I, I— and, and you said by Joe about like him, him, you know, giving us the business on certain ideas, that was in a way very good editing because I'm like, well, I'm going to prove to Joe that he's wrong.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:38:05]: You're right. Like, like, like, there was things that Joe and I always disagreed with, and we'd have great friendly debates. We're still very, you know, good friends. And, uh, and, and some of that came from that we would debate certain things, and so I would like just prove my, my point in my work. And I know that he was kind of doing that to me to make me do that, if that makes sense. Like, every once in a while, he would just like like drop something on me just to like, you know, like mess with my head. This is just to get me to like be sharper, you know. And I, I don't— I'm not sure I needed it all the time, but I love that he did it.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:38:42]: It was so fun. He did it once in front of, uh, uh, we talked about this publicly, like me and Matt Fraction were sitting there talking, Joe comes up, and we just had the most amazing convention. He comes up and goes, you're overwriting. I go, what? He goes, oh, you're, you're strangling your artist to death. I'm like, what? And he goes, You got to, you got to start writing Marvel style. You got to start writing full script. You're killing everybody. And then, and then like kind of walked away and Matt goes, oh, he's fucking amazing.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:39:08]: Because now, now all we're all thinking about is what, what, what happened? And it was, and it did, it did keep me honest, if that makes sense. Like it did keep, it wasn't mean-spirited and it wasn't cruel. It was, it was just, you know, Right. Yeah. And, uh, and also he had— he did have a feeling that I wrote better angry. And I'm like, yeah, I don't need you to make me angry though. I'm like the Hulk. It's always there.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:39:35]: Oh, we think—

Drew Mollo [01:39:36]: great. All right, all right. Leo, you had a question?

Leo Pond [01:39:39]: Well, uh, we had another one come in on Reddit, and I know Kari had, uh, some questions on torso, so I'll just ask this real quick.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:39:46]: Oh, great. Yeah, torso's been on her mind lately.

Leo Pond [01:39:49]: So, uh, Rex Mundi, uh, is asking, uh, and And I'll preface this with, you know, uh, uh, Ultimate Universe is, uh, ending and extremely popular. You have an amazing legacy with, with Ultimate Spider-Man. Uh, would you ever write more Ultimate Peter and MJ because their storyline was left wide open? Uh, Rex Mundy would love to see more of them. Obviously, all—

Brian Michael Bendis [01:40:14]: I, I appreciate that, and maybe one day I'll change my mind. At the moment that I, I really have to remind myself, you did that, do something else, right? One of the, one of the, uh, gifts of Miles Morales and Jessica Jones and Ironheart being out in the world like this, that it does allow me the privilege of putting new stuff out into the world. And I, I would be a fool not to do that instead of just like repeating or, you know, diving back into a pool that I know I can swim in. But, but trying things out that I'm not sure I can do, or, or, or a space where I'm actually more scared of the results is, is, um, it's, it's— that's how you grow. I don't know, all my heroes, my real heroes have really took swings when they were allowed to. And I just, I've just— that's what I feel I should be doing at the moment. I also know that I may wake up get up tomorrow and go, oh my God, I want to write MJ. Oh my God.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:41:17]: And so I'm happy that the door is back open. I have some— and also I'm trying to like— I have some projects coming that may scratch that itch, if not the way I used to, but with some— a new idea that may also help, help that idea, if that makes sense. It's, it's, it's like I really had to like, you know, 19 years over multiple storylines and multiple series going on simultaneously. I really do have to look at that time as mountain climbed and, and, and force myself into scarier or more exciting spaces for me at this time in my life. Um, I, I, um, this is going to sound very— I, I apologize for how this sounds, but like a lot of this is like dreams I had as a child and I was able to fulfill them in a way that I couldn't even perceive as a child because the MCU did not exist when I was a child. Games did not exist when I was a child. Like, none of this was there. So a lot of it was being built around me as I entered the space.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:42:20]: Like, they were like, hey, we're doing games now, you want one? Yeah. You know, so like, it was like, hey, we're doing a cartoon, you want in? Yeah. Like, like, but none of that was what I was considering when I wanted to make comics. So having had the brilliant experience of having some of my childhood dreams come true. Plus, I do spend some time since DC really like considering what are my adult dreams as a creator, and what do I want to achieve now? And a lot of the times it just falls back to more new stuff, more new ideas. So when you look at what I'm doing at Dark Horse right now with Masterpiece and The Ones and Phenomena with Andre Lima at at, uh, Abrams, and I have a new Create Your Own book coming out with David Marquez. Like, these are swings that I'm allowed to take right now, and I'd be furious at myself if I didn't take them. So I hope that makes sense.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:43:15]: It does. Yeah, then I know, I know it's all privilege. I know it's all privilege. I know it is. But I, I, I want to take them, make the most of it until it stops.

Drew Mollo [01:43:24]: Kari, before we had to torso jar MJ, did you have any questions?

Mahanna Jade [01:43:30]: Um, no, like, you know, I just have to be in bed by, you know, reasonable time is all.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:43:33]: All right, when you're ready to go to bed, just hang up on me.

Drew Mollo [01:43:36]: No problem. Just, just mic drop on the Bendis. Be like, Brian, I'm out. Thanks, bye. I, I would absolutely never.

Mahanna Jade [01:43:44]: I'm— first of all, I'm far too British to be that rude. Firstly, I'm far too English for that nonsense. Fair enough.

Drew Mollo [01:43:51]: Jared, you got anything?

Leo Pond [01:43:54]: Oh, you're muted. Sure.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:43:56]: Oh, sounds good too.

Drew Mollo [01:44:01]: Yeah, yeah, that lip syncing was wonderful, buddy, wasn't it?

Jar Jar Jeremy [01:44:05]: What was I singing anyway?

Drew Mollo [01:44:06]: Uh, Mamma Mia. Milli Vanilli.

Jar Jar Jeremy [01:44:09]: Questions coming in from the, the, the outside world. I also, I want to be respectful of Mr. uh, Bendis's time. Mr. I have not gotten any.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:44:20]: I, I'm okay so far.

Drew Mollo [01:44:21]: So he hasn't been texting to try— we're still good, don't push it.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:44:25]: Yeah, we're good. If I had to go, I'd tell you, but we, we—

Jar Jar Jeremy [01:44:27]: but I want to give some of the people from the audience a chance to ask their questions. They, they did show up for us.

Drew Mollo [01:44:33]: Okay, do we got a lot?

Kari Sanders [01:44:35]: Oh yeah, we, we jumping in. I, I am going to steal a moment for Torso though, because please, Torso is amazing. So good. You guys not ready? It's, it's It's, it's a way back comic. It's black and white. You're gonna— it's fucking beautiful. And, um, it's based on a true story. It's some true crime.

Kari Sanders [01:44:56]: We have some Elliot Ness involved. By the way, I did go out. I found you a head. So, um, oh my God, there's one of them. I did my best. What? Well, I, I— also, you're a squirrel puppet and a skull.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:45:13]: I I feel you are a comic book— I can't— there's a pitch here, I can't figure it out. We'll figure it out.

Kari Sanders [01:45:20]: Oh boy, I would be honored, sir.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:45:23]: But I feel a Magnolia comic just got invented right in front of our eyes.

Drew Mollo [01:45:28]: Yeah, she came across Magnolia's drawing board. So I want to go through something where I am also—

Kari Sanders [01:45:35]: I'm an author and I write prose. I'm trying to put something into comics, but eventually, you know, it'll work out. But you and I both have the verboseness. We are both loquacious as we go about, um, our, our writing style. And one of the things that I really loved— I'm going to throw up a couple of pages from Torso right now— is how you guys worked in two panels so that you could write all of the story and all of the dialogue and stuff and still keep things flowing. So I, I just love the way that, like, this is in a morgue. We're looking from the mortician over to people describing like what's going on and being able to have this long conversation to tell people exactly what's going on. And I, I hold it against you not at all that you have to explain this much because it's very important, but you're, you're very good at it.

Kari Sanders [01:46:31]: And following the different panels and things, you have artists that are amazing at putting things together and letting things flow, giving a small little bit of art an entire story as it goes along. And these people back and forth, we see the same face pretty much all the way through here and goes on to just— oh yeah, that's where it was. And I'm giving a big cityscape as the whole city is terrified as to what's going on because people are being murdered here. You guys have to read Torso if you haven't. And this is my last picture, is just throwing in the center— here's all the action going, but we have the conversations going on here and there. And I just, I, I really wanted to say that I appreciate how you're able to work with your letters and your artists and be able to fit everything in because You tell an amazing story, and in cases like Torso, you can't abbreviate it anymore. If you did, it wouldn't be a good story. You have to tell as much as you do.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:47:42]: I appreciate that. Uh, number one, those pages that you just showed, I am the letterer and the artist. And oh wow, and writing most of the dialogue there. Uh, Mark and I absolutely co-created Torso together, but at that time I was because my collaboration muscles weren't— um, I, I was still figuring myself out. So Mark was a friend enough to just go do your thing. And, and so, and Torso is really back in our lives right now because they just announced, uh, Netflix is putting together a version of it from our book. Yeah, man, involved, which I can't wait. And we— and Mark and I just had a very long Zoom meeting with the screenwriter who's taking over, who they haven't announced yet but is a fancy Academy Award person.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:48:30]: And, um, uh, and it was delightful that— like, this, for those who don't know, this book came out almost 30 years ago, and Hollywood has optioned it consistently the entire time. Um, big people attached. David Fincher was attached for a while. It was actually greenlit under David Fincher. Paul Greengrass I was working hard with Corin Hardy before the pandemic to try to get it made. So we've had like— it's been a behind the scenes in my life, a delightful project that has never gone away. I'm always like meeting cool people. I got to meet David Fincher, spend a day with him.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:49:03]: Like, that was so cool, man. Like, I would, I would have paid him money for that. Like, and, and, and yeah, it was an incredible experience and it brought great joy to my life and it— but it's been going on for so long. That we're at the place now where the story of making Torso may be more interesting than Torso. And that's always what you don't want. And I did ask when, when Netflix bought it last summer, I said to my lawyer, are we in the conversation for longest optioned, not made book? And he went, no, Dune, 55 years. And then supposedly Frozen is based on the book that Disney's been holding on to for 75 years, which I did not know. So that we're not even close, but the fact that I even had to ask that question out loud was haunting because I would really like them to make it.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:49:52]: I would really— that would be delightful, but I have no control over that. This version right now feels very strong, and I hope it happens. I will say that I've also said to my students that I accidentally did myself an enormous favor by lettering my own books for many years, so when I enter the space of Avengers and I'm asking things of letterers or colorists or artists that I— I not only do I know how to communicate myself and what I'm asking for because I did it myself, I know how to ask for it, uh, respectfully. Because there's a way to ask for all that shit that's just, you are annoying me. And, uh, and, uh, but there's a— there's a way to like have everyone invested into an idea that— that the pages look this way, or The negative and positive, you see there's a lot of negative space on those pages, which I brought to Jessica Jones. Like, I really do believe that you can create, like, tension with pushing all the panels to the left or right, depending on where the story is, right? So these ideas aren't for every book and not for every storyline that you're doing, but when they— when it's appropriate, it's exciting to be able to, like, bring people together and see if we can do even a better version. Like, all I see when you show those pages worth my mistakes. But, but when I have other people do it— and also there's, I don't know, I, it's, it's funny when I, when I'm, even to this day, when I'm asking something of someone, they, they know I'm, I'm coming from, uh, I did it myself.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:51:23]: I'm not, I'm not asking you to do something I, I don't know how. I know exactly how hard it is to do what I'm asking you to do.

Kari Sanders [01:51:31]: I know. Yeah, it— back then, I know that you— I, I read all of the letters and stuff. I know that you're doing full scripts and you're doing small drawings and stuff that you did purposefully bad— or not, not bad, but inaccurate— so that it wouldn't influence anybody else's artwork, so that— no, they weren't.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:51:50]: Yeah, it was worse than that.

Kari Sanders [01:51:52]: You described it kind of—

Brian Michael Bendis [01:51:54]: yeah, no, I, I, I— when I, when I talk about the early days at Marvel and, and on Sam and Twitch, like, I drew every single page of Sam and Twitch because I at that time could not perceive where the writing stopped. It's all storytelling. And when I was writing and drawing and lettering my own books, I'm writing the whole time. I'm writing when I'm drawing, I'm writing— I'm certainly writing when I'm lettering. Nothing makes you a better editor when you're like, do I need all 40 of these balloons? Jesus Christ. Like, it really makes you think about what you actually need in the script. So that's another reason I tell people to try to letter their own books, just to experience, like, how— what it is that you're doing. So when I entered the Marvel space on the first issues of Jessica Jones and Spider-Man, I was drawing like storyboards basically.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:52:47]: I was drawing like the layouts of the book. And it was Mark Bagley who called me up one day with that lovely Georgia Southern gentleman tone and went, yeah, you don't have to do that. That's my job. And I'm like, oh. And it was so much worse than if he would have yelled at me. He said— he said it so nicely, I was mortified. I was like, oh, I really go, oh, I'm doing it all wrong. Oh my God.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:53:11]: And he was like, no, that's my favorite part. And then I called Gaydos, who I went to college with, so we had a long history together. And I go, are my layouts annoying you? He goes, not annoying, I don't need them. I'm like, okay, I'm gonna stop immediately doing this. And I also had the weird experience of having written a few issues of Sam Twitch for Alex Maleev, drawing them like that, giving them to Alex. We didn't know each other that well, so he was just accepting them. And then when I left the book, Todd took over the book, and Todd didn't even write a script. He would just call Alex up and give him, like, verbalize what he wanted in the script.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:53:48]: So he went from overly written script with layouts to to, hey, and there's a gunfight, and then they're— then they solve the case. And then I saw, to my dismay, that in my opinion, his work with Todd was better than the work that he was doing with me because he didn't feel as confined by my choices. He was doing wonderful work. I— every page of that's beautiful, but I could see where I was kind of holding his neck a little bit, and I didn't mean to. So when we got to Daredevil, no layouts. I just like let like, let this man soar. And that's— and that was part of the magic of those first few issues, is that I had learned a big lesson. I was very deeply embarrassed by myself.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:54:28]: But again, I wasn't coming at it to be because I know better than everybody. I literally didn't know where the job stopped. I literally couldn't find the off-ramp.

Kari Sanders [01:54:37]: So I think that's absolutely fair though, because you— it— when you cut— like, I'm coming from a prose point of view and wanting to write something, and it's just like, I wouldn't know. Like, I, I want this to be emphasized. I want this to have place in something. And you— it just— you don't know how to trust your artist if you've never worked with an artist before, or if you are an artist and you aren't doing the art for it, you want to let them know exactly how you think it should go. So I don't—

Brian Michael Bendis [01:55:04]: yeah, I think there's a big learning curve there.

Kari Sanders [01:55:07]: It's hard not to see the megalomania in it.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:55:10]: So, um, but I, I, I, I will say that, and letting go and letting everyone soar Like, my whole life turned. Like, everything changed in my life. Like, everybody— like, I got— I got— that's the part I got addicted to, is like, it's not going to be exactly the way you wrote, it's going to be something else. It's going to be additive. But 99% of the time, it was better than what was in my head, no matter how focused I was on thinking what Mark Bagley is going to do here. Then Mark Bagley hands it in and go, oh, that's even better than I thought, right? So that, that was That was a great learning curve. I'm glad I got to do it early. I'm glad I got to do it quickly.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:55:49]: Like, that's another reason I'm so grateful for Sam and Twitch. I'm like, oh God, I got that all out of my system beforehand and got to the better part of it. So, and with people that mattered the most to me. So yeah, yeah. It's a big one. Oh, thank you. Also, but I will say for writers listening, I still do the layouts to make sure that what I'm asking for can be done visually. It's like little stick figures, just like, uh, this is— will this all fit on there? Because it's real— a page is real estate, and it's very valuable real estate.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:56:24]: And you have to make sure that, particularly for us verbose writers who want to put a lot of Post-it notes on the art, you want to make sure that it's all going to fit and it's all going to look good and they're not going to get in the way. So I do that a lot. To. And I will say that for even the wordiest pages, the amount of editing I do once the art is in is incredible. Once I see, oh, I don't have to say it, it's all there. If you can see it, you don't have to say it. It's a visual medium. Get out of the way.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:56:51]: So, and even to this day, when I— someone like posts a page, like, years ago I did this thing with Stuart Immonen where like the Ultimatum, you guys remember Ultimatum where they drowned everything, right? So I got to do this great page with J. Jonah Jameson in his office, and it looks like a fishbowl, and, uh, because the city is drowning. And I, I remember, like, it's, it's my favorite, like, page of that era of anything I've done. It was like the most perfect use of Stewart's talent. And when someone posted the art, I was stunned that there were 10 balloons on there. I don't remember there being any balloons on there. Like, I'm like, if I did it today, there would be nothing on there, like nothing. So it's a constant evolution.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:57:33]: I will say though, talking about the verbose writers, we just hear the world very loudly and clearly, and there's a musicality the way people talk. There's a musicality the way people listen to each other and interact with each other. I'm obsessed with it. And when you find characters that can really like do that together, it's, it's, I, it's, it's amazing.

Jar Jar Jeremy [01:57:54]: I, I was gonna ask if you like listen to jazz or anything while writing, because there, there is a rhythm to your writing. Like, uh, not jazz.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:58:04]: I listen a lot of, a lot of, um, punk and a lot of— oh no, yeah, a lot of very, um, if there's, if there's a, like, a deciding thing, there's a lot of emotional, uh, music that's very, very in your face. And, you know, like Beastie Boys and Rancid and like these things where it's like right there and it's pop right away. It's like, you know, second beat, you know what the song is. That kind of stuff is where a lot of my energy comes from. But a lot of playwriting, a lot of other people's dialogue, just when someone's got a flow to their dialogue and it just— nothing delights me more than hearing it. So even when I'm like beating myself up about being too verbose, I'm like, you do really like this. I like— I remind myself, I really like— like when I listen and the Gilmore Girls, or like, you're like, God, I do, I love when the world sounds like this. And I have 4 children and a wife.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:59:00]: I have a very loud house with a lot of crosstalk. It's just my world and it's been my world my whole life. I don't hear anything else, you know? Yeah.

Kari Sanders [01:59:11]: There is absolutely nothing wrong with being verbose, sir. No, just I think about it. But you know, yeah, yeah, I mean, Alan Moore, the king of his— how absolutely— I was terrified of that man, by the way, the first time I met him. And then the second time I met him, he gave me a hug and I was just like, yay! And he sang to her too. He did. He sang songs to me, true, like recorded them. It was, it was beautiful. So before we wrap up, I have a quick question for you here because it has to be mentioned as you're here.

Kari Sanders [01:59:44]: So Powers 25 has been amazing. The mix of classic new characters has been fun. I haven't asked this of you anywhere else yet— why Cutter's daughter? I love her, just curious about the choice.

Brian Michael Bendis [01:59:55]: So I, I am quite obsessed with— and I'm— thank you for reading Powers 25, which is our 25th anniversary of our book Powers, which is being produced, brand new material right now at Dark Horse, is what he's referring to. Um, me and Mike have a big Powers announcement on Friday. And, um, part of, part of what I love about both Dina and some other characters— I love this cops in the generational, cops in the family. And, and I, I love it. I love it in comics too. I love it almost like, oh, you're doing like, like you're— it's the family business. It's not— it's a, it's a calling that becomes a generational calling, you know. Um, you know, I got to work with John Romita Jr.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:00:45]: quite a lot, and, you know, thinking about him and his father, who's very kind to me when I was coming in, um, how, how fascinating that is, just like, like wanting to like sit in your father's shoes. I, I, I, again, I didn't, I didn't really know my dad, so like Like, that's not in me, right? But, but, um, but like, the— you, you'll meet cops and firemen and, and people, uh, who, who are literally like, there's no other path for them. They're like, of course I'm gonna do that. Like, they grew up with it. And, you know, my, my oldest is an adult now, and she's in documentary filmmaking, which is a different lane than mine, but you're still dealing with the same Hollywood that, that I deal with. And I'm, I'm always like, like, you good? And she goes, oh, I learned— like, like, you don't do what I do. Well, I learned a lot, like, like, girl, growing up in the house with— and so we talk about it a lot. We're very close and we talk about a lot.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:01:46]: And it's, um, uh, it's, it's something I'm, I'm obsessed with, like, growing up to do the thing that, you know, or, or having— like, even like in, in show business, you'll see, so you saw it destroy your father and mother, but you still want to do it, or you saw them at their worst and you still think it's magical. Fascinates me, you know? Yeah. So that's why I like to write about it. And also, it's cool to be on a book for 25 years and be around enough to have that character be old enough to then take take center stage, you know. And, and for those of you who've read every issue, great. And if not, don't worry, you didn't miss anything. But boy, we've been, we've been, we've been building towards this for a while. That's, that's a, that's a special, almost only in comics kind of thing you can do.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:02:36]: So yeah, so those are the reasons. But, but, but like, in, in the humanity of generational, you know, or like plumbers, like, I'm gonna be a plumber, my dad was a plumber, like there's like, they can't wait to be a plumber, you know, that kind of stuff just fascinates me to no end. And while there's also, um, children who are like, no, I don't want anything to do— whatever that space you're in, I'm the opposite, I'm going to do that nowhere, nothing, all right. And I, I will, we'll see. I think a couple of my kids are going to be completely the opposite of, of what, what they saw growing up. I'll be thrilled about that too. I both— all, both of it fascinates Fascinates me. And yeah, and as a dad, you have no control over it.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:03:16]: It's just, you know, everyone follows their own path. The only thing I could show my kids— and because of a lot of you, because of you, Drew, um, like, my kids get to go to comic book shows and have fun. But what they've met, what they've learned from me and Kelly and Matt, who the people they grew up with, is like a lot of passion and a lot of positive energy. And they've seen it like come back in our face a lot. Like every interaction we have publicly is delightful, and I know it's weird for them, right? And but, but, but it's always positive. So I'm like, whatever. And I get to say, whatever you do in living, it comes back. Whatever energy you're putting out there, it comes back.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:03:57]: You don't know when, you don't know where, but I have— I, I was told this when I was a kid. I could not understand it, but now that I'm older and it's absolutely happening Miles Morales is a hug that never stops in our family. Never stops, right? My kids get to experience it. Whatever choices they make going forward, can't wait to see if they take that lesson, you know? That's really awesome. That's amazing. Yeah, I did not see any of this coming, and it stuns me when I see it. Yeah, nice.

Drew Mollo [02:04:24]: All right, Leo, do you ready?

Leo Pond [02:04:26]: You ready? Yeah, yeah. Uh, so yeah, I want to let everybody know I'm just share real quick. If you're looking for more information on Brian here, we, we're doing something new. Everybody that we interview, you're getting a page on our site. Thank you. You can come here and find all the information on how to follow you, including your website, Jinx World. Like, recommend reading all our interviews. So, and then any news we do as well as is going to be, uh, you know, a dedicated page just for you, sir.

Leo Pond [02:05:02]: Uh, so everybody, uh, watching or listening, just head to our website and then you can find all the information on Brian, uh, uh, and where to follow you. But where do you like people interacting with you on social media? So say if, uh, like Blue Sky Instagram.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:05:16]: Yeah, I'm on Blue Sky and Instagram the most, but really the, the place where you can have the most— if you buy any issue of Powers 25, you get a code that takes you to the free Jinxworld Discord, which is filled with free comics and scripts and all kinds of great conversation. It's a real tightly curated group, and it stemmed from— if you go to jinxworld.com and you're very serious about your craft, we've been curating and recording and posting, uh, classes, um, featuring all of my friends and peers and you can just dive in. We have like, I think, over 40 classes now and all kinds of different conversations, and everyone's been very generous. We have like Kelly Sue and J.H. Williams, and like anyone I've ever come near, I bullied them onto the class so we can share our knowledge because most of us are are just dying for you to also try to make your own comics and experience what we've experienced, big and small, how, how healing it is, how, how emotionally purifying it can be just to like get stuff out of your system and, and put it out on the page, and how great it can feel to share it with people. So if you're into that space, if you read my book Words for Pictures and are trying to like figure out how to make your stuff, there's classes there. If not, just come to Discord. We share constantly sharing each other's work and stuff like that.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:06:46]: We're just rooting for each other to do our best work. So there you go. But don't forget, nerd stuff, Blue Sky Instagram, all the announcements including Fridays are there. Enjoy them. And I appreciate every, every book you've bought, every, every, every, every, everything I've done that annoyed you that you shared online. I deeply appreciate it. Yes, true.

Drew Mollo [02:07:10]: Yeah, Brian, what other conventions are you going to too so people can meet you and have such a great time like we've had, but in, but in person?

Brian Michael Bendis [02:07:17]: Yeah, I, I do, because I have so many kids, I, the, the appearances are few and far between. I literally just got back from Italy, which was insane. I will be in Cleveland in the summer. They're doing a Jewish Comics Museum. Nice, uh, thing, uh, where, where it's, uh Superman, Harvey Pekar, and my stuff, which is very strange because I like— it's literally like all my dirtbag behavior in the '90s being put on a wall. And, uh, and but I'm there to absolutely just celebrate Superman and the, and the, uh, legacy of which I get to be part of, which is incredible. So I'll be in Cleveland in the summer and other stuff coming when I, when I can schedule it. But, but at the moment I've taken on a few very, very big, very, to me, uh, creatively scary projects, and I'm just going to sit home and do them.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:08:10]: So, uh, but I'm online if you need me. Gotcha, man. All right, guys, um, this, this was— if I can take a minute, I, I— Kari particularly worked very hard to schedule this and make this happen. I just wanted to thank you all for your time and consideration every nice thing you said to me. Uh, it's just incredible to hear, and I just— I, I'm so grateful to everything you said, Drew. I'm grateful for meeting you in 2016. I, I just want to say thank you for all of the warmth and generosity you've shown me the last couple hours, and I hope people enjoy this. And, uh, if you need anything else from me, you give me a call, okay?

Jar Jar Jeremy [02:08:48]: Awesome. I feel Drew's heart just growing.

Drew Mollo [02:08:53]: Yeah, I'm good, guys. I'm gonna need a minute after the show. I might— I'm gonna need a minute. And yeah, I know. Oh my God, I'm coming. Stop it, stop it. We have to— we have to wrap up the show, everybody. Cut to Leo, cut to Leo.

Drew Mollo [02:09:05]: God. Uh, okay, we'll wrap things up real quick.

Leo Pond [02:09:09]: Uh, yeah, uh, find out more about, uh, Brian. There's information showing us up above or down below if you go to the website. That has all the links right there for his, uh, website, uh, Blue Sky, Instagram, everything. We'll do a quick roundup. Uh, MJ, where do you like people following you?

Mahanna Jade [02:09:24]: Um, so the easiest way to get a hold of me and follow my cosplay shenanigans and my con adventures is Instagram, uh, The Cheery Goth. C-H-E-E-R-Y, goth is G-O-T-H. Um, and more Facebook, Mahanna Jade Longwalker. Awesome. Respect the cosplayers.

Drew Mollo [02:09:43]: Yes. Yeah, Jar Jar.

Jar Jar Jeremy [02:09:46]: Hey, uh, everybody follow me over on Twitch. Uh, also check out Instagram, I guess. I'm trying to start to put more stuff up there. Uh, other social media, I'm on there but I'm not, so I don't know. Come check us out at Terrificon this year.

Mahanna Jade [02:10:05]: Yes, absolutely, Kari. Oh yes, Terrificon, please.

Kari Sanders [02:10:10]: We're already ready for you, you guys. I've spent— I've just been ordering all of these things to give away at Terrificon, so you have to come by our booth so I can like hand things to you. I have presents for everybody. Terrificon is August 7th through the 9th at the Mohegan Sun Casino in, uh, Connecticut. Yes, uh, this is put on by Mitch Halleck. It is a fabulous convention. It is our family convention. It is beautiful.

Kari Sanders [02:10:36]: It is wonderful. Yes, we have so much fun. That is where we first met Mahanna, actually. She was a fan and she came on, and now she's like our curious goth girl. So I have like a British competition who doesn't have a squirrel but dresses up in much better costumes than I do.

Mahanna Jade [02:10:51]: Do what? That's not even a competition. But yeah, so we're, we're like besties now.

Kari Sanders [02:10:56]: But anyway, if you want to find me, Terry Sanders. Yeah, um, oh, and Dylan and everybody. I'm, I'm throwing out Dylan because we know Dylan, but if you want to find me, Terry Sanders, just go to Facebook. There's a Judgmental Crow. I write things, I do things. Look there. It's me. That's how you get all the things.

Kari Sanders [02:11:16]: Thank you everybody who showed up tonight and everybody who asked questions on Reddit. We are so excited about having this community grow and grow and bring on people like Mr. Bendis here because you've given us your support. And so we've gotten a chance to like reach out and get some like some confidence, some reach out, some power, some going. So thank you very much everybody.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:11:37]: Everyone should, if you can, if you can this weekend, go to a comic book store and buy something that would surprise you. And if you're having trouble doing that, like, a lot of your favorite superhero creators right now are also doing the work of their lives in creator-owned stuff. You love Matt Fraction's Batman? Oh my God, try Adventure Man with him and Terry Dodson. You like Jason Aaron's, uh, um, Absolute Superman? Try his, uh, Once Upon a Time at the End of the World. Or Bug Wars. Um, Kelly Sue, you love Kelly Sue's Historia, man. FML is gonna blow. It's just about to say FML.

Drew Mollo [02:12:14]: Oh my God, I love FML.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:12:16]: There's John Hickman's creator-owned work. There's like so many creators doing amazing stuff. I've, I've been inundated with outstanding PDFs from some of my favorite creators. There's so many great comics coming out this summer. I, I just go there buy something new, try something else. I— you will— I'm telling you, it's going to open up a whole nother, uh, place in your brain. It's going to knock your socks off. It changed my life.

Brian Michael Bendis [02:12:44]: So, all right, sorry.

Drew Mollo [02:12:45]: No, you're good, you're good. Um, do it. Okay.

Leo Pond [02:12:50]: All right. Uh, Drew.

Drew Mollo [02:12:51]: Drew. Yeah, hi. I'm just gonna say goodbye then. Um, I won't get a full screen, it's okay. Um, hey everybody, thank you so much for joining us. If you really liked what you saw, and we hope you did, Um, hit the like and subscribe button on our YouTube so you can keep following us because we have an amazing lineup still for March. Uh, tomorrow we have the great Fred Van Lente is coming on. He's coming back.

Drew Mollo [02:13:12]: We're going to talk about a lot of great stuff there. Um, next week we have the great Porn— Pornsak Pichetshote coming on. There are so many greats, and we're really— and everybody, if you do what we call hashtag Bendis Challenge, let us know what book you got by which creator because it— and let you know, let us know what you thought, because we will gladly tell them if we should have them on the show. And there's a good chance we already did, or will, or are working on it. Um, thank you so much, everybody. Um, this is one of the best interviews that we've had all year, if not for a while. And I again was not kidding when I might really cry. So we're gonna cut before— because I don't want to see Brian Michael Bendis made me cry, because I feel like that's going to end up some clickbait bullshit, and I don't want that.

Drew Mollo [02:13:53]: So I'd hug you right now, but if before It's funny, and I hug you right back, and I crack your back like a chiropractor, buddy. But thank you, everybody. Have a good night. Goodbye. Happy St. Bendis Day— I mean Patrick's Day. Horizon—

Leo Pond [02:14:05]: before—

Brian Michael Bendis [02:14:06]: sorry, what was that, Brian? Pornsak Pichetshote was the mind behind The Horizon Experiment from Image Comics. It's a genre-bending, incredible experience. All of you should have read it before he's on the show. It's that. I highly, highly, highly recommend it. All right, got it. Bye. Thank you.